Re: Project architecture

• Subject: Re: Project architecture
• From: "Webobjects Developer" <email@hidden>
• Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 14:28:09 -0700
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You're completely correct that most (all?) publishing systems have
this problem. And I think you (and others) are right that inserting
special placeholder HTML is not a big problem. But as I asked to
another responder:

When the designer adds a new page, what process takes place after
that? Does a programmer need to be involved (assuming that the new
page is dynamic, but only uses existing WO components)? Does the
application need to be rebuilt and deployed again?

Also, I think you're right on when talking about the whole "HTML"
thing. Unfortunately, that's the way things are right now. So finding
tools to deal with it is the problem at hand.

CSS is nice too, but ultimately doesn't help for structural layout (at
least without also changing the underlying HTML "data"). Admittedly,
layout may change less frequently than text on the page. But it still
does change.

I think it's also noteworthy to mention that WO is not unique in this at
all.  You would have exactly the same issues with anything based on J2EE.
JSPs are not dissimilar to WO Templates.  Even some scripting solutions like
Ruby on Rails are not immune from this.  You're still going to have
programmer specific custom tags within the UI that a pure web designer will
have to work around.

I personally think the real problem is not that HTML is for designers, but
that designers are having to deal with HTML "code."  If the web was build by
designers instead of programmers then designers would not ever see the HTML
code.

Designers working in Adobe InDesign never see, or care anything about, how
InDesign keeps track of formatting text and graphics on a page, nor should
they.  On the contrary a UI programmer cares very much about how the system
organizes windows and views within those windows.  They need to know
specifically how to interact with those objects from within their code.

So this is not IMHO a failure in any way of WebObjects or any other
solution, it's a failure of the basic design of the Web in general.  So we
do the best we can by building good communication and cross training between
coders and designer to work around this fundamental flaw.

CSS is helping, but it's still to much for the programmer and not enough for
the designer, this is getting better all the time as the design tools
improve.  A Web build by the likes of Adobe would have made it a much
difference place than it is today.  Designer wouldn't be dealing with code
and there would be a much more distinct divide between web "pages" and web
"applications."

On Mar 29, 2007, at 4:08 PM, Webobjects Developer wrote:

Using WO, how does one separate the web designer from the programmer?

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