August 2011 - colorsync-users

Colorimeters and third-party developer support
by Howard Simkins 19 Aug '11

19 Aug '11

I need some clarification: As I understand it there are 3 different colorimeters 1- 1- color munki that works with color munki software only 2- 2 - a colorimeter that works for OEM 3rd party software only 3- 3 - a colorimeter that works for xrite software only Please correct if I’m wrong Also which model number is which? Thanks Howard Simkins Professor, Co-ordinator of Computer Technology, Faculty of Animation Arts and Design. Apple Distinguished Educator Adobe Education Leader (HiEd) Sheridan Institute of Technology and Advanced Learning 1430 Trafalgar Road Oakville, Ontario, L6H 2L1, Canada tel. 905.845.9430 x2625 fax. 905.815.4043 howard.simkins(a)sheridanc.on.ca

1 0

Subject: Colorimeters and third-party developer support
by SteveRankin 19 Aug '11

19 Aug '11

All, > As the product manager for our Display Solutions at X-Rite, let me try to clarify a few things regarding OEM and 3rd party developer support for our new i1D3 based colorimeters. There seems to be lot¹s of confusion here. First and foremost, X-Rite absolutely does allow OEMs and 3rd party developers access to our i1Display Pro retail instruments. Karl Koch already mentioned it here on the ColorSync List that BasICColor will support our retail product and I now have permission from EIZO to announce that a soon to be released version of ColorNavigator software will also support our retail i1Display Pro device. In addition, while I cannot mention their names, I can tell you that there are more OEMs & developers currently working on integrating our channel device into their software solutions. So, for any other OEMs or third party developers that wish to also support our retail i1Display Pro device, please contact devsupport(a)xrite.com and ask for our ³i1Display Pro License Request Form². Second, regarding support of OEM versions of i1D3, this is not an X-Rite issue at all. Any software developer who wishes to support an OEM version of the i1D3 device must contact and obtain this ability from that OEM. I hope this clarifies things and I must say it¹s nice to see such the demand for our new products. Best regards, Steve. The information contained in this e-mail and any accompanying attachments may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, or if this message has been addressed to you in error, please immediately alert the sender by reply e-mail and then delete this message and any attachments. Any dissemination, distribution or other use of the contents of this message by anyone other than the intended recipient is strictly prohibited. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email or any attachments.

2 1

Re: X-Rite Colorimeters and third-party developer support
by Jan-Peter Homann 19 Aug '11

19 Aug '11

Hello richard, list and Tom, Richard, thank you very much for bringing this topic to the list. I understand, that X-Rite limits the usage for the entry-level instruments ColorMunki. But doing this also for the i1 display Pro is a catastrohpe. Currently, tasks like profiling and quality control are more and more integrated directly into applications. If I´m using different applications I need an instrument, which can be used with every application. From my point of view, I would not have a problem, if such an instrument costs 50$ more than a version which can only be used with one specific software (either X-Rite or OEM software). Tom, could you please response to the list, that X-Rite is aware of this problem and ready to communicate with the color management community e.g. through this list. Best regards Jan-Peter Am 19.08.11 06:57, schrieb Rich Wagner: > Hardware-agnostic software packages used in color management (such as Argyll, ColorEyes, BasICColor, CalPC, PatchTool, BabelColor CT&A, and others) currently support an impressive number of sensing devices. Unfortunately, these outstanding software applications will not be able to support several new color measurement devices, thanks to new policies from X-Rite. > > A few weeks ago X-Rite announced the availability of two new colorimeters: the i1 Display Pro and the ColorMunki Display. > > Here is the current status on third-party software support for these X-Rite products, as noted by a third-party software developer: > > ColorMunki Display > > As in the past for previous Munki instruments, there is no third party Software Development Kit (SDK) available. An SDK is essentially the driver and software libraries that enable third party developers to communicate with the instrument. This does not mean that the SDK does not (or could not) exist, it only means that it is not available to third-party developers; in other words, this is a business decision! Thus, until such an SDK is available, third party developers cannot provide support for the Munki series of instruments (just as they currently cannot provide support for the HP DreamColor-branded, i1-Display2-based colorimeter). > > i1 Display Pro > > This model replaces the i1 Display2. As with the i1 Display2, there are three Categories of the i1 Display Pro available: > > Category (a)- The instruments sold by X-Rite under the X-Rite name (also called the retail version). In the past, the i1 SDK could be used for instruments in this category (e.g., the i1 Display 2); this is NOT possible with the SDK of the i1 Display Pro. > > Category (b)- The instruments sold by a third party (called Original Equipment Manufacturer, or OEM). The SDK could, and can still be used for instruments in this category. However, in the past such instruments had the same communication interface specifications as the X-Rite retail model; this is no longer the case. > > Category (c)- The instruments sold by an OEM, which have communication interface specifications DIFFERENT from the Category (b) model. The SDK cannot be used to communicate with those instruments. > > As examples, the custom i1 Display2 recommended by NEC for many wide-gamut NEC monitors (called the MDSVSENSOR2) is a Category (b) model while the HP-branded i1 Display2 (HP DreamColor Advanced Profiling Solution, KZ300AA) sold by HP for use with the HP DreamColor monitors is a Category (c) model. (Note that while the NEC MDSVSENSOR2 has the same communication interface as the standard i1 Display2, it has a different set of sensor filters which is better adapted to the wide gamut primaries of many NEC monitors.) > > In the past, the X-Rite SDK could be used with the Category (a) and (b) instruments; this explains, for instance, why third party software can be used with the X-Rite i1 Display2 and the NEC i1 MDSVSENSOR2, but not with the HP DreamColor i1 Display2. > > With the new X-Rite policies, the i1 Display Pro sold by X-Rite can *ONLY* be used with i1 Profiler; it *CANNOT* be used with the i1 Display Pro SDK. This means that third party developers *cannot* support this instrument. Third party developers can only support the Category (b) and (c) instruments (Category (c) instruments will also require a separate agreement between the third-party developer and the licensed OEM). In addition, Category (b) and (c) instruments *CANNOT* be used with the i1 Profiler software (or other X-Rite software); if you want to use i1 Profiler, you need to buy a retail i1 Display Pro from X-Rite. > > These new policies severely limit customer benefits since the new colorimeters can only be used with the bundled software they are sold with (from either the OEM or from X-Rite). This really stinks!!! > > These changes do not affect the i1 Pro (a spectrophotometer that provides spectral data) as it is not currently being replaced by a new model, and is still supported by the older third party X-Rite SDK. > > For those concerned about the implications of these new X-Rite policies - in particular, if you feel that you (or your clients) would benefit from using third party software with an X-Rite branded ColorMunki Display or i1 Display Pro - I suggest you communicate with your X-Rite representative or file a complaint via the X-Rite general support page: > http://www.xrite.com/contact_us.aspx?reasonid=3 > > Personally, I will not buy another X-Rite product until this policy is changed. The current policy is bad for consumers and is anti-competetive. Competitors, start your engines... and consumers, consider your choices carefully before making purchases. > > --Rich Wagner _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/homann%40colormanage… > > This email sent to homann(a)colormanagement.de > -- ---------- Please note the new adress -------------- homann colormanagement --------- fon +49 30 611 075 18 Jan-Peter Homann ------------ mobile +49 171 54 70 358 Cotheniusstr. 3 -------- http://www.colormanagement.de 10407 Berlin -------- mailto:homann@colormanagement.de

1 0

Re: Color Management for iPad? / Corporate colors?
by Louis Dery 18 Aug '11

18 Aug '11

Color management for pictures on iPad… OK, but what about corporate colors on iPad? here´s the link of a demo about "color management for corporate colors on iPad: http://www.couleur911.com/ipad_color_management_4_en.html I don’t know what digital magazine and book publishers for iPad are doing to solve this issue? Maybe they don’t do anything and simply convert everything to sRGB? What do you think? Louis Dery www.couleur911.com

7 10

Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 8, Issue 182
by Louis Dery 17 Aug '11

17 Aug '11

Hi Jurgen, here is some answers to your questions: Le 2011-08-12 à 15:01, colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com a écrit : > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 15:35:40 -0400 > From: J Richter <jr-winner(a)sympatico.ca> > Subject: iPad calibration/characterization... > To: Colorsync-users on Apple Lists <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> > Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP270A8CE8C8ED01672233BA86220(a)phx.gbl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed > > While a noob to this ipad/tablet gizmo currently under discussion, I have some relevant questions: > > - So what is the color gamut for iPads? You can see a comparative chromaticity graph at: http://www.couleur911.com/ipad_color_management_3_en.html > - Is it the same for ipad I and II? I’ve compared 6 iPads 1 against iPad 2 and visually they are the same > - Is there [any] consistency from one ipad to another? The most important difference is the white point > - Even if you could characterize or profile a specific tablet, is there any drift of accuracy, and over what amount of time? Over time I don’t have the answer yet. > - do they have to be "warmed up" too, before profiling a unit, if even possible? I would guest 5 minutes, but I didn’t test warm up comparison yet. > - If not sRGB, then what is a better/more realistic/accurate gamut? I’ve compared many RGB color spaces (sRGB, Adobe RGB, Apple RGB, Generic RGB, etc.), none of them have the same "blue" chromatic characteristic of the iPad. But if you want to use one, take Apple Generic RGB. It is not perfect, specially for the blue, but it is the closest one. > - What about other android OS pads/tablets... what gamut is "standard" for this OS if not sRGB? Didn’t test other tablet yet. > - Are any android apps even color management savvy and actually make use of any ICC profiles that might be built into an image? Don’t have the answer. > > Hoping there is maybe a color management 101 document floating around that is specific to these sort of devices; if not, some answers to these questions would be appreciated. Thank you. > > Jurgen Richter Louis Dery louisdery(a)videotron.ca Rés.: 418-877-2381 Cell.: 418-805-9689

1 0

Using Auto Luminance on NEC 3090: OK or No?
by Rick Gordon 16 Aug '11

16 Aug '11

I just got an NEC LCD3090WQXi monitor, calibrating with SpectraView II & NEC packaged i1Display v2 sensor. Auto luminance (ambient light adjustment) is a feature, currently disabled. My monitor is in a windowed room (indirect light) and I may be working day or night. Would auto luminance be a feature best avoided, or will a calibration be effectively invalidated by the ambient light adjustment? -- ___________________________________________________ RICK GORDON EMERALD VALLEY GRAPHICS AND CONSULTING ___________________________________________________ WWW: http://www.shelterpub.com

1 0

NEC PA271W
by Ken Fleisher 12 Aug '11

12 Aug '11

On the Chromix ColorWiki review for the NEC PA271 < http://www.colorwiki.com/wiki/NEC_PA271W_Review> it states: "This review assumes the user would be using either of the NEC programs for calibrating this display since they are the only available means of accessing the internal graphics." Since this review was almost a year ago, does anyone know if this is still true or are there other software now that can access the internal LUTS? Thanks. Ken

7 12

iPad calibration/characterization...
by J Richter 11 Aug '11

11 Aug '11

While a noob to this ipad/tablet gizmo currently under discussion, I have some relevant questions: - So what is the color gamut for ipads? - Is it the same for ipad I and II? - Is there [any] consistency from one ipad to another? - Even if you could characterize or profile a specific tablet, is there any drift of accuracy, and over what amount of time? - do they have to be "warmed up" too, before profiling a unit, if even possible? - If not sRGB, then what is a better/more realistic/accurate gamut? - What about other android OS pads/tablets... what gamut is "standard" for this OS if not sRGB? - Are any android apps even color management savvy and actually make use of any ICC profiles that might be built into an image? Hoping there is maybe a color management 101 document floating around that is specific to these sort of devices; if not, some answers to these questions would be appreciated. Thank you. Jurgen Richter The problem is that the iPad has a very different color gamut compared to sRGB. Specially in the blue hue and the saturation overall. If you prefer to think they look the same... It is up to you! My point about color management for the iPad is more about magazine, publications, etc. were color is as much important as their printed versions. Louis Dery

1 0

Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 8, Issue 180
by Louis Dery 11 Aug '11

11 Aug '11

The problem is that the iPad has a very different color gamut compared to sRGB. Specially in the blue hue and the saturation overall. If you prefer to think they look the same... It is up to you! My point about color management for the iPad is more about magazine, publications, etc. were color is as much important as their printed versions. Louis Dery Transmis via mon iPad Le 2011-08-11 à 05:27, colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com a écrit : > Message: 11 > Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 11:26:37 +0200 > From: Ren? Damkot <rene(a)damkot.com> > Subject: Re: Color Management for iPad? / Corporate colors? > To: undisclosed-recipients: ; > Cc: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > Message-ID: <4E43A04D.8030605(a)damkot.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed > > Roger, > > If by that you mean "assume sRGB for display". I'd say yes. > Just do what Safari (and most of Windows) has always done. In this case, > it actually makes a bit sense. ;) > > > > Grtx, > > RenÃ© Damkot > www.damkot.com > www.getcolormanaged.com

4 3

RE: Un-Calibrated Monitors and Calibrated with Spectraview
by L Williams 11 Aug '11

11 Aug '11

> I don't believe photoshop uses icc profile you made for your nec monitor. This doesn't make sense to me. Not sure what you are trying to say. When I use softproof, I select the Canon paper that I am going to print on which is the ICC profile for that paper. If I want to download it to Adorama for printing, I choose the ICC profile for their paper. And as far as purchasing a nongraphics monitor, I didn't want to take a chance that it wouldn't stay calibrated for more than 24 hours which is what happened with the current monitor I was using. So I'm glad you are happy with your $500 monitor. Just in case you haven't looked at Shutterbug magazine website, there was an article I read about nongraphics monitors in which the writer had two monitors which were the same models and one wouldn't stay calibrated and the other would. Rather than go through the trial and error of purchasing a $500 monitor and possibly having the same problem, I made the decision to spend more and get the NEC monitor which is just as good as yours. > Subject: Re: Un-Calibrated Monitors and Calibrated with Spectraview > From: csync(a)colorforest.net > Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 18:52:35 -0400 > To: lgw_lynn(a)hotmail.com > > I don't believe photoshop uses icc profile you made for your nec monitor. If i am not wrong since ver 5.5 (this is what i use), maybe also ver cs5 can use icc profiles on external monitor. If you use cs3, cs4 or maybe even cs5 photoshop will not use icc profile on secondary monitor. What I suggest you do connect your nec, move menus to it to be primary. Calibrate and open photoshop. As long as mac menu are on your nec it should work fine. > > There is no problem with using cheap monitors as long as this is not on the laptop and is not a secondary monitor. I am using hp LP2475w and I am very happy with it. I think I paid about $500 for it. I bet it is as good as yours. I am using i1 pro and color eyes display for calibration. My monitor and my printers (epson 9800 and 4880) are dead on. Printers are profiled with isis and calibrated Once a week. > > Best Regards, > > Derek Lambert >

1 0