September 2014 - colorsync-users

Re: Printing Press Simulations from Acrobat
by Louis Dina 30 Sep '14

30 Sep '14

@Roger… I tried converting the color in Acrobat, but got the same result. It was worth a try. Thanks. @Scott… You have confirmed my suspicion that Acrobat wasn't printing correctly. What a shame that Acrobat Pro doesn't print accurate color managed press proofs now that the world has embraced a PDF workflow. You'd think they'd have gotten it right by now. Go figure. I'll continue to print hard copy press proofs from InDesign or Photoshop, because I know they are working correctly. Appreciate it. Lou On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Scott Martin <scott(a)on-sight.com> wrote: > Acrobat, as it turns out, is a lousy RIP with minimal color management > capabilitties. RIPing your PDF in Photoshop and printing from there has > been a long standing ‘fall back’ procedure that service bureaus and print > vendors use when all else fails. > > Scott Martin > *www.on-sight.com <http://www.on-sight.com>* > *www.martinphoto.com <http://www.martinphoto.com>* > > >

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Printing Press Simulations from Acrobat
by Louis Dina 30 Sep '14

30 Sep '14

I posted this previously in the adobe Acrobat Forum, but got no answer, so I thought I'd try here… I created a CMYK file for press in InDesign CS6 (Mac OSX 10.8.5). I exported from ID to PDF using PDF/X-4. The output intent is Coated_GRACoL 2006 (ISO 12647-2:2004). The file checks out great in ID and Acrobat preflight and all is as it should be. I wanted to print a hard copy press simulation on my Epson 3880 (custom RGB profiles, no RIP). I set up Acrobat Output Preview with the above profile, Simulate Paper Color and Simulate Overprinting. I left the Output Preview window open. Then I printed it from Acrobat X Pro (v10.1.12). I selected Advanced > Color Management with the following settings: Acrobat Color Management Chose my custom RGB Inkjet profile I checked Apply Output Preview Settings Then I printed the file. There are pure white elements in this design, and using a loupe, it is clear that no dots were laid down to simulate the paper color. It also appears that the print is darker than it should be, so I don't think it is simulating press blacks, but the deeper blacks I can achieve on my inkjet with a semigloss RC paper. I printed the same file from InDesign and it properly lays down dots in the pure white components and prints a less dense black. BTW, I chose to leave the Output Preview dialog box open in Acrobat, because a previous print from Acrobat also gave me pure whites. I thought perhaps you need to keep that dialog box open to retain the simulation settings, but open or closed, I got the same results. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I can't figure out what it is. Or, is Acrobat not working properly for printing press simulations? Thanks, Lou

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Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 11, Issue 141
by Axel Robert 25 Sep '14

25 Sep '14

Good morning, Thank you for your feedback. To Martin and Thomas. I agree. This software needs to be improved. By the way, the failure doesn't come from the paper, but from a primary color, more specifically the 100% Magenta. This solid colour is out of tolerance for the DeltaH. To Andreas. I am going to follow your suggestions even if the blamed sample is not the Cyan but the Magenta. You however are right when you say that the rounding is not handled consistently between the software. They differ but are almost coherent between those judging ok or not. Nonetheless I yesterday evening tested with PatchTool from BabelColor. The result is coherent with Alwan and basICColor. Axel De : "colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users-request@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users-request@lists.apple.com>> Répondre à : "colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Date : mercredi 24 septembre 2014 21:00 À : "colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Objet : Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 11, Issue 141 Send Colorsync-users mailing list submissions to colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/colorsync-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users-request@lists.apple.com> You can reach the person managing the list at colorsync-users-owner(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users-owner@lists.apple.com> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Colorsync-users digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Inconsistent proof control results. (Axel Robert) 2. Re: Inconsistent proof control results. (Martin Orpen) 3. Re: Inconsistent proof control results. (Thomas Richard) 4. Re: Inconsistent proof control results. (Andreas Kraushaar) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 15:02:12 +0000 From: Axel Robert <axel.robert(a)ubisoft.com<mailto:axel.robert@ubisoft.com>> To: "colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Subject: Inconsistent proof control results. Message-ID: <D048A264.257FF%axel.robert(a)ubisoft.com<mailto:D048A264.257FF%axel.robert@ubisoft.com>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear all, I would like to have your opinion according the quality of proofing software control results. I did a contract proof (12647-7) and test it on several Proof Control software. And the results are very disappointing for me because no one is correlated to the others. It's very frustrating and even more embarrassing for our production which goes to our Printers all around the world. Let me be more explicit. A contract proof has been made with a GMG ColorProof RIP. The first time i verified it with GMG ProofControl, it failed. I tested it with Oris Certified and it passed. I tested it with Alwan Print Verifier and it failed. I tested it with basICColor Catch Qc and it failed. I tested again in GMG ProofControl after the software crashed, relaunched the PC and the software and it passed. Besides basICColor where I used the FD7, all others softwares used the same i1Pro RevD. Any idea or suggestions? Thank you. Axel Axel Robert | UBISOFT Prepress & graphic Chain quality manager ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 16:20:19 +0100 From: Martin Orpen <martin(a)idea-digital.com<mailto:martin@idea-digital.com>> To: "'colorsync-users?lists.apple.com' List" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Subject: Re: Inconsistent proof control results. Message-ID: <1C9E7F24-C4CA-469F-A992-82B67241F14F(a)idea-digital.com<mailto:1C9E7F24-C4CA-469F-A992-82B67241F14F@idea-digital.com>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 On 24 Sep 2014, at 16:02, Axel Robert <axel.robert(a)ubisoft.com<mailto:axel.robert@ubisoft.com>> wrote: A contract proof has been made with a GMG ColorProof RIP. The first time i verified it with GMG ProofControl, it failed. I tested it with Oris Certified and it passed. I tested it with Alwan Print Verifier and it failed. I tested it with basICColor Catch Qc and it failed. I tested again in GMG ProofControl after the software crashed, relaunched the PC and the software and it passed. ProofControl is an appallingly written bit of software. Older versions will not only crash but also kill the performance of the whole platform as the job database will soak up *all* of the memory resources of your PC. The latest version doesn’t do this but still freezes and falls over on a daily basis :-( It’d be helpful if you said what caused the validation failure though — if it’s failure on the yellow primary then this is usually caused by paper feed adjustment issues. -- Martin Orpen Idea Digital Imaging Ltd ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 17:21:44 +0200 From: Thomas Richard <tr(a)e-b-v.de<mailto:tr@e-b-v.de>> To: "colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Subject: Re: Inconsistent proof control results. Message-ID: <p0623090dd048914bd005(a)[192.168.111.25]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello Axel, A contract proof has been made with a GMG ColorProof RIP. The first time i verified it with GMG ProofControl, it failed. I tested it with Oris Certified and it passed. I tested it with Alwan Print Verifier and it failed. I tested it with basICColor Catch Qc and it failed. I tested again in GMG ProofControl after the software crashed, relaunched the PC and the software and it passed. Besides basICColor where I used the FD7, all others softwares used the same i1Pro RevD. Any idea or suggestions? Are those measurements homogenous? Was it always the same field that causes the fail? Was it a very close 'Out of Range' field? MfG Thomas Richard ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 18:48:55 +0200 From: Andreas Kraushaar <andreas.kraushaar(a)gmx.de<mailto:andreas.kraushaar@gmx.de>> To: Axel Robert <axel.robert(a)ubisoft.com<mailto:axel.robert@ubisoft.com>> Cc: "colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>" <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>> Subject: Re: Inconsistent proof control results. Message-ID: <76E62F7D-10BE-4366-BD5D-B898A26293A4(a)gmx.de<mailto:76E62F7D-10BE-4366-BD5D-B898A26293A4@gmx.de>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Hi Axel, to sort out differences resulting from repeated readings (repeatability) I would start with one measurement (file) and import the measurement data to be sure to only check the conformance assessment part (and instrument precision, patch uniformity, XRGA conversion etc). If the mismatch is only (mostly) on the 100 Cyan patch it is quite likely an XRGA “issue” :-) Then look at the protocols and download the Fogra Excel spreadsheet (not sexy but functional): http://www.fogra.org/en/fogra-fogracert-en/print/processstandard-digital/ps… I can imagine that the rounding is not handled consistently. I hesitate to say “correctly” since we clarified the rounding with ISO 12647-8. The correct interpretation can be found in PSD (chapter 6) alongside with some examples. http://www.fogra.org/en/fogra-standardization/digital-printing-2-48/digital… looking forward to your findings regards Andy Kraushaar On 24 Sep 2014, at 17:02, Axel Robert <axel.robert(a)ubisoft.com<mailto:axel.robert@ubisoft.com>> wrote: Dear all, I would like to have your opinion according the quality of proofing software control results. I did a contract proof (12647-7) and test it on several Proof Control software. And the results are very disappointing for me because no one is correlated to the others. It's very frustrating and even more embarrassing for our production which goes to our Printers all around the world. Let me be more explicit. A contract proof has been made with a GMG ColorProof RIP. The first time i verified it with GMG ProofControl, it failed. I tested it with Oris Certified and it passed. I tested it with Alwan Print Verifier and it failed. I tested it with basICColor Catch Qc and it failed. I tested again in GMG ProofControl after the software crashed, relaunched the PC and the software and it passed. Besides basICColor where I used the FD7, all others softwares used the same i1Pro RevD. Any idea or suggestions? Thank you. Axel Axel Robert | UBISOFT Prepress & graphic Chain quality manager _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com>) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/andreas.kraushaar%4… This email sent to andreas.kraushaar(a)gmx.de<mailto:andreas.kraushaar@gmx.de> Follow us on Twitter - twitter.com/fogra_org Dr.-Ing. Andreas Kraushaar Dept. Prepress Fogra Graphic Technology Research Association Streitfeldstrasse 19 81673 Munich, Germany Telefon: +49 89. 431 82 - 335 Telefax: +49 89. 431 82 - 100 E-mail: kraushaar(a)fogra.org<mailto:kraushaar@fogra.org> Internet: www.fogra.org ----------------------------------------------------------------- This e-mail message may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not an addressee or otherwise authorized to receive this message, you should not use, copy, disclose or take any action based on this e-mail or any information contained in the message. If you have received this material in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message. Managing Director: Dr. Eduard Neufeld | Registered Office: Munich | Register of Associations: VR 4909 ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Colorsync-users mailing list Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com<mailto:Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/colorsync-users End of Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 11, Issue 141 ************************************************

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Inconsistent proof control results.
by Axel Robert 24 Sep '14

24 Sep '14

Dear all, I would like to have your opinion according the quality of proofing software control results. I did a contract proof (12647-7) and test it on several Proof Control software. And the results are very disappointing for me because no one is correlated to the others. It's very frustrating and even more embarrassing for our production which goes to our Printers all around the world. Let me be more explicit. A contract proof has been made with a GMG ColorProof RIP. The first time i verified it with GMG ProofControl, it failed. I tested it with Oris Certified and it passed. I tested it with Alwan Print Verifier and it failed. I tested it with basICColor Catch Qc and it failed. I tested again in GMG ProofControl after the software crashed, relaunched the PC and the software and it passed. Besides basICColor where I used the FD7, all others softwares used the same i1Pro RevD. Any idea or suggestions? Thank you. Axel Axel Robert | UBISOFT Prepress & graphic Chain quality manager

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What does Colorsync Utility’s "Softproof PDF/X Output Intent" exactly do?
by Jorge . 23 Sep '14

23 Sep '14

In Colorsync Utility, what does the checkbox Softproof PDF/X Output Intent exactly do? I mean, I do asume it converts all colors in a PDF/X document to the Output Intent, but I mean from what exactly it is converting and how: 1. Does it still use Generic CMYK as **source** space for untagged CMYK data (therefore performing a conversion from Generic CMYK to the Output Intent, in which case, with what Rendering Intent), just like with any other PDF? Or does it assume, when the checkbox is checked, that such data is already in the Output Intent’s color space? 2. Once all colors are in the PDF/X Output Intent, what Rendering Intent is it using then to convert them to my Monitor's color space? Acrobat has checkboxes for "Simulate paper color" (which I asume means Absolute Colorimetric; defaults to off) and "Simulate black ink" (which I asume means Relative Colorimetric without Black Point Compensation; defaults to off, which I guess is Perceptual/RC + BPC). The fact that, in Colorsync Utility, whites remains white, but black is washed out compared to Acrobat’s defaults lead me to think that it is using Relative Colorimetric without Black Point Compensation. But if such is the case, is it possible to convert using a Perceptual/Black Point Compensation-like conversion instead?

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Re: Quato Excellence and Mavericks
by info＠haut-touch.com 22 Sep '14

22 Sep '14

Thanks a lot for your answer. We are using EyeOne Display Pro. On 22/09/2014, at 15:43, Bernd Noppenberger <Bernd.Noppenberger(a)page-one.de> wrote: > > When you want to use basiccolor display what kind of measurement device do > you use?

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Quato Excellence and Mavericks
by info＠haut-touch.com 22 Sep '14

22 Sep '14

Hello Support Team We are planning to update the OS of our workstations running on Mountain Lion to Mavericks. Due to the decease of Quato and the obvious lack of software support of the company, we are planning to use BasICColor Display on 2 Quato Excellence 26. Does anybody has experience using BassICColor Display to calibrate Quato Excellence monitors under Mavericks? Thanks for your help Xavi Carreras Retouching Studio HautTouch Pellaires, 30-38 (Palo Alto) 08019 Barcelona T + 34 93 458 11 86 M + 34 629 31 32 96 www.haut-touch.com

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Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 11, Issue 137
by Louis Dina 14 Sep '14

14 Sep '14

Thanks Ray. That was exactly what I was looking for. Worked like a charm!! Appreciate it! Lou > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2014 14:17:57 -0400 > From: Raymond Cheydleur <wrayc(a)comcast.net> > To: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > Subject: Re: Recovering Measurement Data from i1Profiler > Message-ID: <350885AF-F0FE-483B-B2ED-48B328856275(a)comcast.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 > > As long as your profile has cxf measurement data in it, the easiest way to > get the raw data is to bring it back into i1Profiler itself. > 1)While in the Profiling workflow, drag the profile onto the measurement > icon in the workflow at the bottom. > 2) Switch to that section if you weren’t already there. > 3) Chose Save in the page data section (right above workflow) > There are several options you can save i1Profiler’s own version of CxF > which includes a custom resource for other data, a standard CxF file an > i1Profiler CGATS file (this has the chart and spectral data). If you want > just Lab and XYZ you might choose i1Profiler CGATs custom which gives you a > host of options for both data and formatting. > > RayC >

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Recovering Measurement Data from i1Profiler
by Louis Dina 14 Sep '14

14 Sep '14

I have built quite a few RGB profiles for my Epson printer using the Epson driver and i1Profiler. At the time of profiling, I did not know the measurement data was not saved in the profile (I was used to ProfileMaker), so I did not save the measurement data. I have the chart definitions, the text files for the charts, and the profiles, but no actual measurement data files. Is there any way to recover or easily reconstruct this information from the above files? I looking to recover Lab or spectral readings from the profiling target. Thanks, Lou

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Chrome managing color but using wrong monitor profile
by Wayne Bretl 13 Sep '14

13 Sep '14

Working on a PC with two monitors, a ViewSonic more-or-less sRGB and a HP ZR30w wide gamut monitor. When viewing images on Flickr: Internet Explorer, as expected, pays no attention to monitor profile and is therefore oversaturated on the HP. Chrome appears to read the HP profile, no matter which monitor you open it on, so colors are muted on the ViewSonic. Photoshop seems to know which monitor it's on and uses the correct profile. Any thoughts on how to make Chrome do the same?

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