December 2017 - colorsync-users

RE: UV Offset Printing (Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57)
by Roger Breton 09 Dec '17

09 Dec '17

I remember having to give press approvals for magazine covers at one of our sister plants when the interiors would be ran web but the customer insisted that the cover be ran sheetfed, and showing up on press to find out that the sister plant in question was using UV inks to run the job, because the client wanted UV varnish, and only having our humble SWOP3 proofs to show… I was surprised that we were able to match color to the client satisfaction. Not perfect but plenty close. That client was a bitch… I had to personally do all her color corrections, at her office… But her expresso coffee machine was good – small consolation :) / Roger From: Terence Wyse [mailto:wyseconsul@mac.com] Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 4:36 PM To: 'colorsync-users?lists.apple.com' List <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> Cc: Scott Martin <scott(a)on-sight.com>; Roger Breton <graxx(a)videotron.ca> Subject: UV Offset Printing (Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57) I’ve “G7’d" a few UV offset presses and their behavior is not all that different than normal offset. Some things to consider: * Ink chroma is down a little from typical offset inks. As I recall, yellow chroma/density was a bit less and black ink density especially was lower than typical coated offset. I recall black density on coated papers to be around 1.50-1.60 or about -.20 from non-UV inks. for this reason, SWOP colorimetry works better than GRACoL on coated papers. * Where the curing lamps are positioned makes a big difference in the overprint colorimetry. Interdeck curing results in a “dry” trap between units. If you want ink trap behavior more typical of offset inks, wet trap between the units and don’t cure until the last ink goes down. If you wet trap, you’ll get overprint colorimetry closer to GRACoL/SWOP/FOGRA. In my opinion, the best use of UV-cure offset inks is on uncoated papers where you can use a much higher ink film thickness without having ink drying issues. Also, the rather flat/matte look of UV inks doesn’t look so bad on matte uncoated papers. When printing on gloss coated papers, the gloss differential of the inks is pretty noticeable unless you post-coat. My 360-390nm worth. :-) Terry On Dec 8, 2017, at 4:20 PM, Roger Breton <graxx(a)videotron.ca <mailto:graxx@videotron.ca> > wrote: Scott, "UV Offset" and/or "UV Hybrid" inks, such as those used in sheetfed offset lithography, 40" Heidelgerg, Komori, Mitsubishi, Roland, KBA presses, to my humble knowledge, are formulated with a photo-initiator such that they instantly dry when illuminated by a light source containing certain wavelengths of light, in the UV range, such as 360nm. I'm not sure if it's that exact wavelength, though. I confess I have not personally seen much "UV curable inkjet printing" in my young carreer. Please excuse my ignorance but where have you seen them being used? Is that what Mike was referring to? Sorry I missed that entirely. Best / Roger -----Original Message----- From: Colorsync-users [ <mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com> mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Scott Martin Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 9:11 AM To: colorsync-users < <mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 I see! Mike is asking about UV offset, not UV curable inkjet printing... Scott Martin <http://www.on-sight.com/> www.on-sight.com On Dec 7, 2017, at 3:51 PM, Roger Breton <graxx(a)videotron.ca <mailto:graxx@videotron.ca> > wrote: Good points, Paul. I have personaly seen many sheetfed presses running UV inks hitting pretty much the same Lab colorimetry on their process color inks than with conventional inks. / Roger -----Original Message----- From: Colorsync-users [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Paul Sherfield Sent: Thursday, December 7, 2017 7:16 AM To: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com <mailto:colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 Hi Mike If the UV offset inks match ISO 2846 then the standard Fogra 39/51/47/52 or G7 based profiles can be used as normal for proof simulation and process control on press. Regards Paul Sherfield The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd 07899 906385 http://www.missinghorsecons.co.uk Follow us on: Twitter.com/missinghorse Member - UK TC130 Technical Advisory Group (ISO 12647 Printing Standards) Chair - BPIF Colour Quality Scheme certification steering group UK Representative-ISO TC130- WG13 for printing standards certification _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com <mailto:Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> ) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/graxx%40videot ron.ca This email sent to graxx(a)videotron.ca <mailto:graxx@videotron.ca> _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. 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Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 59
by Mike Stewart 08 Dec '17

08 Dec '17

Thanks for the info. As far as uncoated is concerned; wouldn't the UV inks sit on top of the stock and not bleed creating a wider colour gamut. Mike On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 2:00 PM, <colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com> wrote: > Send Colorsync-users mailing list submissions to > colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/colorsync-users > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > colorsync-users-request(a)lists.apple.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > colorsync-users-owner(a)lists.apple.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Colorsync-users digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. RE: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 (Roger Breton) > 2. Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 (Scott Martin) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2017 16:51:12 -0500 > From: "Roger Breton" <graxx(a)videotron.ca> > To: "'Paul Sherfield'" <paul(a)missinghorsecons.co.uk>, > <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> > Subject: RE: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 > Message-ID: <28c501d36fa5$80a65df0$81f319d0$(a)videotron.ca> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Good points, Paul. > > I have personaly seen many sheetfed presses running UV inks hitting > pretty > much the same Lab colorimetry on their process color inks than with > conventional inks. > > / Roger > > -----Original Message----- > From: Colorsync-users > [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On > Behalf Of Paul Sherfield > Sent: Thursday, December 7, 2017 7:16 AM > To: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 > > Hi Mike > > If the UV offset inks match ISO 2846 then the standard Fogra 39/51/47/52 or > G7 based profiles can be used as normal for proof simulation and process > control on press. > > Regards > > Paul Sherfield > > The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd > > > 07899 906385 > > > http://www.missinghorsecons.co.uk > > Follow us on: Twitter.com/missinghorse > > Member - UK TC130 Technical Advisory Group (ISO 12647 Printing Standards) > Chair - BPIF Colour Quality Scheme certification steering group UK > Representative-ISO TC130- WG13 for printing standards certification > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync- > users/graxx%40videotron.ca > > This email sent to graxx(a)videotron.ca > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2017 08:11:28 -0600 > From: Scott Martin <scott(a)on-sight.com> > To: colorsync-users <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> > Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 > Message-ID: <2004C980-B2DD-4CE0-954A-C5E02CFD0388(a)on-sight.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > I see! Mike is asking about UV offset, not UV curable inkjet printing... > > Scott Martin > www.on-sight.com > > > > > On Dec 7, 2017, at 3:51 PM, Roger Breton <graxx(a)videotron.ca> wrote: > > > > Good points, Paul. > > > > I have personaly seen many sheetfed presses running UV inks hitting > pretty > > much the same Lab colorimetry on their process color inks than with > > conventional inks. > > > > / Roger > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Colorsync-users > > [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On > > Behalf Of Paul Sherfield > > Sent: Thursday, December 7, 2017 7:16 AM > > To: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > > Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 > > > > Hi Mike > > > > If the UV offset inks match ISO 2846 then the standard Fogra 39/51/47/52 > or > > G7 based profiles can be used as normal for proof simulation and process > > control on press. > > > > Regards > > > > Paul Sherfield > > > > The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd > > > > > > 07899 906385 > > > > > > http://www.missinghorsecons.co.uk > > > > Follow us on: Twitter.com/missinghorse > > > > Member - UK TC130 Technical Advisory Group (ISO 12647 Printing Standards) > > Chair - BPIF Colour Quality Scheme certification steering group UK > > Representative-ISO TC130- WG13 for printing standards certification > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > > Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) > > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync- > users/graxx%40videotron.ca > > > > This email sent to graxx(a)videotron.ca > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > > Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) > > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync- > users/scott%40on-sight.com > > > > This email sent to scott(a)on-sight.com > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Colorsync-users mailing list > Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/colorsync-users > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 59 > *********************************************** >

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RE: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57
by Roger Breton 08 Dec '17

08 Dec '17

Good points, Paul. I have personaly seen many sheetfed presses running UV inks hitting pretty much the same Lab colorimetry on their process color inks than with conventional inks. / Roger -----Original Message----- From: Colorsync-users [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Paul Sherfield Sent: Thursday, December 7, 2017 7:16 AM To: colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com Subject: Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57 Hi Mike If the UV offset inks match ISO 2846 then the standard Fogra 39/51/47/52 or G7 based profiles can be used as normal for proof simulation and process control on press. Regards Paul Sherfield The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd 07899 906385 http://www.missinghorsecons.co.uk Follow us on: Twitter.com/missinghorse Member - UK TC130 Technical Advisory Group (ISO 12647 Printing Standards) Chair - BPIF Colour Quality Scheme certification steering group UK Representative-ISO TC130- WG13 for printing standards certification > > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/graxx%40videotron.ca This email sent to graxx(a)videotron.ca

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UV Offset Printing
by Mike Stewart 07 Dec '17

07 Dec '17

Anyone creating contract proofs for UV sheetfed offset printing; either for coated or uncoated? If so, then what are you using for a "target"? Mike Stewart

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Re: Colorsync-users Digest, Vol 14, Issue 57
by Paul Sherfield 07 Dec '17

07 Dec '17

Hi Mike If the UV offset inks match ISO 2846 then the standard Fogra 39/51/47/52 or G7 based profiles can be used as normal for proof simulation and process control on press. Regards Paul Sherfield The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd 07899 906385 http://www.missinghorsecons.co.uk Follow us on: Twitter.com/missinghorse Member - UK TC130 Technical Advisory Group (ISO 12647 Printing Standards) Chair - BPIF Colour Quality Scheme certification steering group UK Representative-ISO TC130- WG13 for printing standards certification > >

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RE: UV Offset Printing
by Roger Breton 07 Dec '17

07 Dec '17

Probably some GRACoL or ISO flavor, Mike? It's up to the printer to get their act together to hit that proof as best as they can. My two cents / Roger -----Original Message----- From: Colorsync-users [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Mike Stewart Sent: Wednesday, December 6, 2017 8:41 AM To: colorsync-users <colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com> Subject: UV Offset Printing Anyone creating contract proofs for UV sheetfed offset printing; either for coated or uncoated? If so, then what are you using for a "target"? Mike Stewart _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/graxx%40videotron.ca This email sent to graxx(a)videotron.ca

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Blackmagic is also available for proofing
by Gary Hawkey 01 Dec '17

01 Dec '17

https://www.serendipity-software.com.au/products/blackmagic <https://www.serendipity-software.com.au/products/blackmagic> Gary Hawkey | www.iocolor.com 206.223.1845 O | 206.551.3434 C

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Re: Epson SureColor P800 Inkjet Printer as proofer
by Alexey Gribunin 01 Dec '17

01 Dec '17

Hello Mark! I profiled two SC-P800's on Epson Standard Proof Paper Semimatt and GMG CheckProof Semimatt 200g driven with EFI eXpress RIP (CMYK driver). It gave me enough gamut to simulate Fogra 39 (ISOCoated v2) according to ISO 12647-7. But if you need wide gamut proofer to simulate Pantones or extended gamut press then it's not a perfect choice. From my opinion this machine is usable only for classic CMYK press simulation (within reasonable ISO tolerances), not more. PS: As Andrew Rodney wrote, CMYK driver (i.e. some kind of RIP) is preferable. However I think that RGB driver should also be enough to get simple Fogra 39 proofs from Photoshop using Photoshop's ColorManagement. Best regards, Alexey Gribunin, UNIT Color Technologies, Moscow, Russia. > Wondering if I could get an opinion as to the viability of using the Epson > SureColor P800 Inkjet Printer as a pre-press proofing printer? > > Wouldn't need big proofs, just good, accurate proofs. I would do all of the > necessary custom profile generation myself, so I wouldn't be using a > "canned" profile for the paper/ink combination I settle on.

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Re: Epson SureColor P5000 RIP
by Thomas Richard 01 Dec '17

01 Dec '17

Maybe overkill, but supports the desired printer: >Release of GMG ColorProof 5.9 > >* New Features >o Epson SureColor SC-P5000 V and Epson SureColor SC-P5000 STD (LLK) >o Epson SureColor SC-P10000 / SC-P20000 https://supportuk.gmgcolor.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000947245-Release-of-GM… MfG Thomas Richard >I've got a new Epson P5000 on order, and I'm looking for a RIP. I >passed on the Designer edition partly because I didn't realize the >selection of RIPs had decreased so much. > > > >Apparently ColorBurst only sells OverDrive now. I used the Fiery >eXpress a few years ago and didn't like it, but possibly this is my >only solution. > > > >Features I most want: > > >PostScript >Spot color matching (Pantone). >Paper color simulation. > > >What's out there that can do these things? > >Gary Smith > > _______________________________________________ >Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users(a)lists.apple.com) >Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/tr%40e-b-v.de > >This email sent to tr(a)e-b-v.de

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Epson SureColor P5000 RIP
by PPS Lists 01 Dec '17

01 Dec '17

I’ve got a new Epson P5000 on order, and I’m looking for a RIP. I passed on the Designer edition partly because I didn’t realize the selection of RIPs had decreased so much. Apparently ColorBurst only sells OverDrive now. I used the Fiery eXpress a few years ago and didn’t like it, but possibly this is my only solution. Features I most want: PostScript Spot color matching (Pantone). Paper color simulation. What’s out there that can do these things? Gary Smith

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