PowerPoint for Mac has been nicely color-managed for some years. I bought the first version of Keynote but quit using it after a week. PowerPoint is adequate and a lot easier to share. ........................................................ Don Hutcheson HutchColor, LLC 87 Brass Castle Rd Washington, NJ 07882, USA office: (908) 689 7403 cell: (908) 500 0341 skype: hutchcolor ........................................................ On Jan 08, 2013, at 13:17 , colorsync-users-request@lists.apple.com wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Martin Orpen) 2. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Dana Rasmussen) 3. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Andrew Rodney) 4. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (edmund ronald) 5. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Andrew Rodney) 6. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Steve Upton) 7. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Andrew Rodney) 8. RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Matt Beals) 9. RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Roger Breton) 10. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Claas Bickeböller) 11. Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Matt Beals) 12. RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? (Matt Beals)
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Message: 1 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 20:01:46 +0000 From: Martin Orpen <martin@idea-digital.com> To: "'colorsync-users?lists.apple.com' List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <303A8BA7-F433-4587-830D-8EEE88F0FBA8@idea-digital.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On 7 Jan 2013, at 18:47, Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> wrote:
FWIW, I'm running 10.8.3
When are you going to give Apple the go ahead to release it?
-- Martin Orpen Idea Digital Imaging Ltd
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Message: 2 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 12:08:30 -0800 From: Dana Rasmussen <geek707@gmail.com> To: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <D396876E-A805-4514-9041-75AEEF56B73D@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
As shocking as this seems, I can't find another explanation. Images imported into Apple's Keynote do not seem to be color managed. The do not match the same image in Preview, Safari or Photoshop (the later three matching perfectly). These are TIFFs with an embedded sRGB profile. On a wide gamut display, they look pretty awful (over saturated) in Keynote. Sorry if this new discovery is well know around here but this begs the question: Apple, what are you thinking?
FWIW, I'm running 10.8.3 and Keynote 09 (5.0.3)
Also under 10.8, what's up with the dock icon? They too don't appear to be color managed expect for the Finder icon there.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/ Is any flavor of Powepoint colormanaged? For Win or Mac? I am not surprised given what these applications are designed to be used for. Dana Rasmussen Seattle
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Message: 3 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 13:24:23 -0700 From: Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> To: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <E94B6EC6-C7BD-44BC-9198-2D6B1F9347BD@digitaldog.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Or just confirm or deny my findings.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/
On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:44 PM, Lars Borg <borg@adobe.com> wrote:
Edmund,
Right, it's far from trivial. It would be great if you could contribute to a solution to the problem.
Lars
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Message: 4 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 21:39:35 +0100 From: edmund ronald <edmundronald@gmail.com> To: Lars Borg <borg@adobe.com> Cc: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <CAJe_MaiPBupAr10RwW=bv35FmyaUgvyVPrQOsBLCg75TkETiVw@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Lars,
We have been down this road, and I have made precise and constructive suggestions a bunch of times.
As regards core OS routines, my suggestion to improve color management in user apps has been that we design an OS method such that one can see immediately which transforms (profiles, intents) have been cumulatively applied to an image, or propagated through a file. A programmer will never notice from a *look* at his screen which transforms are being called.
You can of course say that this is now *impossible* and it may well be, but then why stick to a design which just cannot be implemented and verified except by the most specialized of specialists?
We have run through years of bug after bug in the profiled inkjet printing field in Mac OS, please don't tell me this isn't true because everyone here even including Andrew Rodney has noticed it, with profiled printing becoming essentially irreproducible for a period, exactly because no diagnostic facilities were ever embedded in the OS, because none were ever envisaged at design time by the ICC, in the interest of no vendor ever ever ever being *provably* designated as responsible for a color management failure.
Edmund
On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:44 PM, Lars Borg <borg@adobe.com> wrote:
Edmund,
Right, it's far from trivial. It would be great if you could contribute to a solution to the problem.
Lars
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Message: 5 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 13:43:24 -0700 From: Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> To: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <36FABCC2-C6DD-4024-A153-9EAF134A3AE4@digitaldog.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Jan 7, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Dana Rasmussen <geek707@gmail.com> wrote:
Is any flavor of Powepoint colormanaged? For Win or Mac?
Indeed, my copy of Powerpoint for Mac (2011) DOES preview the sRGB document correctly like Preview, Safari, Photoshop etc. Keynote doesn't.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/
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Message: 6 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 14:12:32 -0800 From: Steve Upton <upton@chromix.com> To: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <C5E28EB1-AA26-4320-9AEE-230EAA3CF48A@chromix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:43 PM, Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> wrote:
On Jan 7, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Dana Rasmussen <geek707@gmail.com> wrote:
Is any flavor of Powepoint colormanaged? For Win or Mac?
Indeed, my copy of Powerpoint for Mac (2011) DOES preview the sRGB document correctly like Preview, Safari, Photoshop etc. Keynote doesn't.
I'm pretty certain that Keynote *used* to color manage properly, though it might depend on the image format used.
perhaps it's dropped off the radar over the years and as Keynote came out on iOS (which is certainly not going to be color managed)
Steve
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Message: 7 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 15:53:07 -0700 From: Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> To: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <4B2FE791-1CFF-4EEB-9E4C-E9A5EF672E0D@digitaldog.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Jan 7, 2013, at 3:12 PM, Steve Upton <upton@chromix.com> wrote:
I'm pretty certain that Keynote *used* to color manage properly, though it might depend on the image format used.
That's one reason why I asked here as I don't recall this behavior either. I've been using Keynote for years. On a wide gamut display with sRGB tagged data, the preview is way off. I think this might have happened with 10.8, which I recently upgrade on this Mac.
I exported the show as a PowerPoint presentation, it shows exactly as it should in PP (the little thumbnails don't but who cares)? At least Microsoft's presentation software is working but I'd sure prefer Keynote.
Seems odd that Preview would show the images correctly but not Keynote. Odd too that the two software teams may not be talking to each other about this <g>
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/
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Message: 8 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 16:42:33 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Beals <matt@mattbeals.com> To: Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> Cc: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <1357605753.463418282@apps.rackspace.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
I don't have keynote so I cannot confirm this but what we used to do for Publisher was to save the image out of PhotoShop as an EPS with I believe and 8bit TIFF preview. This prevented Windows GDI from mucking around with the separations for that image. Your mileage may vary.
Matt Beals Consultant Callas Partner/Trainer Enfocus Certified Trainer Markzware Recognized Trainer (206) 618-2537 - Mobile mailto:matt@mattbeals.com
Come visit me at: http://www.automatetheworkflow.com http://www.mattbeals.com http://blog.mattbeals.com
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On Monday, January 7, 2013 10:47am, "Andrew Rodney" <andrew@digitaldog.net> said:
As shocking as this seems, I can't find another explanation. Images imported into Apple's Keynote do not seem to be color managed. The do not match the same image in Preview, Safari or Photoshop (the later three matching perfectly). These are TIFFs with an embedded sRGB profile. On a wide gamut display, they look pretty awful (over saturated) in Keynote. Sorry if this new discovery is well know around here but this begs the question: Apple, what are you thinking?
FWIW, I'm running 10.8.3 and Keynote 09 (5.0.3)
Also under 10.8, what's up with the dock icon? They too don't appear to be color managed expect for the Finder icon there.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/ _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/matt%40mattbeals.com
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Message: 9 Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 20:38:21 -0500 From: Roger Breton <graxx@videotron.ca> To: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <006f01cded40$d7d283c0$87778b40$@videotron.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Matt,
You ARE the Swiss Army knife of color management ;-)
Best / Roger
-----Original Message----- From: colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Matt Beals Sent: Monday, January 7, 2013 7:43 PM To: Andrew Rodney Cc: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: RE: Apple Keynote not color managed?
I don't have keynote so I cannot confirm this but what we used to do for Publisher was to save the image out of PhotoShop as an EPS with I believe and 8bit TIFF preview. This prevented Windows GDI from mucking around with the separations for that image. Your mileage may vary.
Matt Beals Consultant Callas Partner/Trainer Enfocus Certified Trainer Markzware Recognized Trainer (206) 618-2537 - Mobile mailto:matt@mattbeals.com
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Message: 10 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 18:26:37 +0100 From: Claas Bickeböller <lists@bickeboeller.name> To: "colorsync-users@lists.apple.com List" <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <EA3B7C01-47B3-4286-8546-35BF458FEFCE@bickeboeller.name> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi,
Keynote 5.1.1 (09) on OS X 10.6.8 makes use of source profiles. I never checked in detail how the transformation to the display profile is done but there is a clear difference between JPGs tagged with sRGB and ProPhotoRGB having the same device values.
If this behaviour is different in newer OS X versions I'd also appreciate if Apple would change this.
Best regards
Claas
Am 07.01.2013 um 21:43 schrieb Andrew Rodney:
On Jan 7, 2013, at 1:08 PM, Dana Rasmussen <geek707@gmail.com> wrote:
Is any flavor of Powepoint colormanaged? For Win or Mac?
Indeed, my copy of Powerpoint for Mac (2011) DOES preview the sRGB document correctly like Preview, Safari, Photoshop etc. Keynote doesn't.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/ _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/lists%40bickeboeller...
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Message: 11 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 10:16:46 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Beals <matt@mattbeals.com> To: Dana Rasmussen <geek707@gmail.com> Cc: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: Re: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <1357669006.71459565@apps.rackspace.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Back when there was a Windows GDI, I believe it's been separated out or at least renamed to WCS, it was all sRGB and Publisher/Windows would convert everything to sRGB. The mystery meat CMYK profile was some abomination of SWOP. I believe I have the SWOP profile somewhere around here as well as some samples of the separations if anyone is interested. I haven't paid too much attention to in Windows 7/8 since I encourage everyone to leave everything as RGB (sRGB to be safe and specific) on any Windows version.
But for the Mac side of things I can't say specifically. Just make everything sRGB (as bad as that sounds) and work from there. But now that I think about it a bit there was the whole "colormatch RGB" thing that keeps gnawing in the back of my mind as a default space for Mac OS X.
At any rate, assume it's not, convert to sRGB and expect moderate success.
Matt Beals Consultant Callas Partner/Trainer Enfocus Certified Trainer Markzware Recognized Trainer (206) 618-2537 - Mobile mailto:matt@mattbeals.com
Come visit me at: http://www.automatetheworkflow.com http://www.mattbeals.com http://blog.mattbeals.com
Friends don't let friends write HTML email
On Monday, January 7, 2013 12:08pm, "Dana Rasmussen" <geek707@gmail.com> said:
As shocking as this seems, I can't find another explanation. Images imported into Apple's Keynote do not seem to be color managed. The do not match the same image in Preview, Safari or Photoshop (the later three matching perfectly). These are TIFFs with an embedded sRGB profile. On a wide gamut display, they look pretty awful (over saturated) in Keynote. Sorry if this new discovery is well know around here but this begs the question: Apple, what are you thinking?
FWIW, I'm running 10.8.3 and Keynote 09 (5.0.3)
Also under 10.8, what's up with the dock icon? They too don't appear to be color managed expect for the Finder icon there.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/ Is any flavor of Powepoint colormanaged? For Win or Mac? I am not surprised given what these applications are designed to be used for. Dana Rasmussen Seattle
Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/matt%40mattbeals.com
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Message: 12 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2013 10:17:30 -0800 (PST) From: Matt Beals <matt@mattbeals.com> To: Roger Breton <graxx@videotron.ca> Cc: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: RE: Apple Keynote not color managed? Message-ID: <1357669050.60343413@apps.rackspace.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Thanks! Always nice to be able to contribute after having so many people help me.
Matt Beals Consultant Callas Partner/Trainer Enfocus Certified Trainer Markzware Recognized Trainer (206) 618-2537 - Mobile mailto:matt@mattbeals.com
Come visit me at: http://www.automatetheworkflow.com http://www.mattbeals.com http://blog.mattbeals.com
Friends don't let friends write HTML email
On Monday, January 7, 2013 5:38pm, "Roger Breton" <graxx@videotron.ca> said:
Matt,
You ARE the Swiss Army knife of color management ;-)
Best / Roger
-----Original Message----- From: colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com [mailto:colorsync-users-bounces+graxx=videotron.ca@lists.apple.com] On Behalf Of Matt Beals Sent: Monday, January 7, 2013 7:43 PM To: Andrew Rodney Cc: colorsync-users@lists.apple.com Subject: RE: Apple Keynote not color managed?
I don't have keynote so I cannot confirm this but what we used to do for Publisher was to save the image out of PhotoShop as an EPS with I believe and 8bit TIFF preview. This prevented Windows GDI from mucking around with the separations for that image. Your mileage may vary.
Matt Beals Consultant Callas Partner/Trainer Enfocus Certified Trainer Markzware Recognized Trainer (206) 618-2537 - Mobile mailto:matt@mattbeals.com
_______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Colorsync-users mailing list (Colorsync-users@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/matt%40mattbeals.com
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