Hi Lou, The answer to your question: "But, when you soft proof, with the Paper White box checked, shouldn't the soft proof look the same on a 5000K and a 6500K MONITOR?" No, they will not look the same, The paper white simulation is "relative to your monitor white point". EIZO ColorNavigator or X-Rite's i1Profiler's monitor profiling modules offer validation against CMYK standards. At the end of the validation, the measured value of paper white for FOGRA39 verification can be reported to be very close to 95,0, -2. But do not let this measurement mislead you. This is only true "relative" to the monitor white (native or any other monitor white that you have picked) which now serves as the 100, 0, 0 reference. You can set the white point of calibration to any temperature in the 5000 to 6500 K range and after every calibration/profiling round the validation may tell you that Patch # 63 (paper white) of UGRA/FOGRA Media Wedge v3 is measuring within a deltaE(2000) less than 1 against 95, 0, -2. But in absolute terms the simulated color on the screen is different every time. In the verification module of DisplayCAL, you can switch "Simulate whitepoint" and "Relative to display profile whitepoint" on or off to measure the actual color of the monitor white. Soft proofing heavily relies on the adaptive capability of the eye. Just try to find the color temperature that is right for you using a proper light box and the print substrate that you frequently use. And this pick will only work for your eyes. Recently, I have calibrated a monitor at 100 K increments in the 4800 to 6500 K range. Next to it was a desktop viewer with fresh lamps illuminating a sheet of FOGRA39 compatible print stock. The whole screen was simulating FOGRA39 paper white in Photoshop. Going through the profiles one after the other, my colleagues have asked 6 different people which color temperature gave them the best match. No two picked the same temperature. As the monitors create the illusion of white by using 3 narrow band emissions at blue, green and red regions of the visible spectrum. One monitor, as a light source, may have a CRI value of 37 (3 very narrow band emission) and the other may have a CRI value of 93 with no gaps in the spectral emission curve. In fact, I repeated the test with this high CRI monitor and more people agreed on the color temperature that gave the best match. Monitors are very different from each other, you may find very different display panels in monitors of a certain brand. Best regards, -------------------------------------------------------- Refik Telhan, EE B.Sc. Light and Color Management Consultancy Aydogdu Sokak 12A, Tarabya Mahallesi Sariyer, 34457, Istanbul, Turkey Mobile: + (90) (532) 426 21 87 -------------------------------------------------------- On 04.03.2019 19:40, "colorsync-users on behalf of Louis Dina" <colorsync-users-bounces+rtelhan=icloud.com@lists.apple.com on behalf of lou@loudina.com> wrote: I have some confusion on the selection of white point when calibrating my monitors. I have always used Native White Point and had good results with my Dell Adobe RGB LCD monitor. A good monitor to print match is important to me. The Native WP on this monitor is around 5700-5800K, which works well with the somewhat neutral to warm papers I print on. I know that an image displayed in Photoshop without an active soft proof will be mapped to monitor white . So, a monitor calibrated to 6500K will display cooler than a monitor calibrated to 5000K. But, when you soft proof, with the Paper White box checked, shouldn't the soft proof look the same on a 5000K and a 6500K MONITOR? As I understand it, two "conversions" occur. The first conversion is from the document working space to the printer profile. Then a second conversion occurs from the printer profile numbers to the monitor using RC rendering. If neither Black Ink or Paper White boxes are checked, the simulation on screen ignores paper color and weak blacks. But, if Paper White is checked, shouldn't the paper color and reduced dynamic range appear the same on monitors that are calibrated differently. That doesn't seem to be my experience. I'm assuming that the monitor profiles accurately characterize the current calibration of each monitor. I'd prefer to calibrate to 6500K, but I find my prints always come out too yellow because I am adding more yellow to my image on screen to compensate for the cooler display. When printed, the warmth of most of my papers results in skin tones that are too yellow. What am I missing? Thanks, Lou _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. colorsync-users mailing list (colorsync-users@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/colorsync-users/rtelhan%40icloud.com This email sent to rtelhan@icloud.com