Hi Steve, Thanks for the response. I'm sure there is variation in how the two spectros calibrate - the tile on the iO table vs. the i1Pro2's tile. And yes, the former does get more dust & needs cleaning fairly frequently. But let me offer a bit more info, maybe this will help clarify my question: For a given media - Epson's Watercolor Radiant White, e.g. - the media WP measured by the original i1Pro *consistently* shows as L*97, and this is across charts measured this year and old ones from as far back as 7 years ago (same WP value even in CMYK profile created for ColorBurst RIP). Measuring the same media last month with my i1Pro2, the media WP reported is L*94. I get similar discrepancies measuring charts on other papers Granted that I haven't had it recertified lately, but it seems like my older spectro is performing pretty consistently, on this single measurement, anyway! My i1Pro2 also seems to be performing as it's supposed to; printing with profiles created with its measurements seems to work as expected. But soft-proofing with those profiles is way off. As I mentioned, I saw another poster on a different list claim that the current version of the software reports WP readings lower than those from same charts, same i1Pro2 spectro, but older version (v.1.3.2?) of i1Profiler. I don't know if this is true, I'm just noticing a problem as above & wonder if anyone else has seen this phenomenon. Oh yes, and both pass i1Diagnostics 4.1.0. Maybe this is unique to my setup, or maybe I'm unique by using both instruments. But it sure looks like more than just standard inter-instrument disagreement... John JWL Images Emeryville, CA On Jul 10, 2014, at 12:00 PM, colorsync-users-request@lists.apple.com wrote:
Message: 3 Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2014 13:16:43 -0700 From: Steve Upton <upton@chromix.com> To: colorsync-users colorsync-users <colorsync-users@lists.apple.com> Subject: Re: White point readings - i1Pro2 vs. original Message-ID: <F25499E0-3A7A-4B01-A26B-D05A1AF0F052@chromix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Jul 7, 2014, at 12:41 PM, John Lund <john@jwlimages.com> wrote:
Hello colorsyncers,
I am seeing what looks like a bug in how media white point is reported when driving my i1Pro2 with the current i1Profiler (version1.5.4). Measuring charts of the same paper twice - once with i1Pro2 (MO), then again with my original i1Pro in an iO table - the first reading reports paper white point as L*94, while the second is L*97. This pattern seems to be consistent for the several matte papers I have read lately.
I don't see significant differences in the results of printing with the two profiles, but obviously this effect plays havoc with soft-proofing.
A poster on the Luminous Landscape forums described similar errant readings using an i1Pro2, and claims the problem went away after reverting to i1Profiler v.1.3.
Before I go to that extreme, I wanted to ask here - has anyone else seen this? Is this a bug in the current software? (seems weird that the earlier i1Pro apparently is not affected)
When the i1 is in the iO it uses different calibration patches, is it possible that one of them is really dirty & the instrument is calibrating differently?
regards,
Steve
On Jul 11, 2014, at 5:51 PM, John Lund <john@jwlimages.com> wrote:
For a given media - Epson's Watercolor Radiant White, e.g. - the media WP measured by the original i1Pro *consistently* shows as L*97, and this is across charts measured this year and old ones from as far back as 7 years ago (same WP value even in CMYK profile created for ColorBurst RIP). Measuring the same media last month with my i1Pro2, the media WP reported is L*94. I get similar discrepancies measuring charts on other papers
The bottom line is, X-rite changes things and the results therefore change. Case in point was some hardware change in the iSis between Rev C and E which produced a similar difference you report. Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/
On Jul 11, 2014, at 4:56 PM, Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> wrote:
On Jul 11, 2014, at 5:51 PM, John Lund <john@jwlimages.com> wrote:
For a given media - Epson's Watercolor Radiant White, e.g. - the media WP measured by the original i1Pro *consistently* shows as L*97, and this is across charts measured this year and old ones from as far back as 7 years ago (same WP value even in CMYK profile created for ColorBurst RIP). Measuring the same media last month with my i1Pro2, the media WP reported is L*94. I get similar discrepancies measuring charts on other papers
The bottom line is, X-rite changes things and the results therefore change. Case in point was some hardware change in the iSis between Rev C and E which produced a similar difference you report.
Yeah, that and the i1 Pro 2 really is a different beast than the original i1 Pro… That said, I would think that they would differ more in b* values than L* values. When we did the SWOP Proofing study for IDEAlliance back in 2008 we piggybacked a test of all the devices used in the study to get a feeling for the “agreement” between them. It’s interesting to note that the biggest difference between all the i1 Pros was in L* and once I massaged the numbers as a test to normalize the L* values of the measurements, the instruments agreed quite well. (or at least WAY better) A quick question, are you using the same software to drive both of them? Modern versions of measurement apps will drive the older i1 Pro according to XRGA calibration, which should agree better with the i1 Pro 2…. than again, maybe you got a bum i1 Pro 2 & should contact X-Rite to see what they have to say about it. Steve
Hi Andrew, Thanks. Yes it's frustrating. It does seem strange that the current software gets the same WP reading from the original i1Pro, it's only the newer instrument that reports a L* value that seems to be too low… John JWL Images Emeryville, CA On Jul 11, 2014, at 4:56 PM, Andrew Rodney <andrew@digitaldog.net> wrote:
On Jul 11, 2014, at 5:51 PM, John Lund <john@jwlimages.com> wrote:
For a given media - Epson's Watercolor Radiant White, e.g. - the media WP measured by the original i1Pro *consistently* shows as L*97, and this is across charts measured this year and old ones from as far back as 7 years ago (same WP value even in CMYK profile created for ColorBurst RIP). Measuring the same media last month with my i1Pro2, the media WP reported is L*94. I get similar discrepancies measuring charts on other papers
The bottom line is, X-rite changes things and the results therefore change. Case in point was some hardware change in the iSis between Rev C and E which produced a similar difference you report.
Andrew Rodney http://www.digitaldog.net/
participants (3)
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Andrew Rodney
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John Lund
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Steve Upton