November 2009 - Darwin-dev - lists.apple.com

Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by Fabien Costantini 30 Nov '09

30 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.fr; s=s1024; t=1259604654; bh=18GVlKpVKknZKjZ5+uriF55lLONgYubDqUpbqFnBamc=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=gpLcN7KkKePvoib3QLZuObnRFmIJ/d5e4j1VFEJUcMkaTHsN3etSfbdnMzD9cmsCYtNPnv9NR6F5H3lGN9O/T5RGaCQeCg2zje4Bu13jsUq9ZGGPpEK41wSene7ifLzfIyEw7zvfQyflG6OrwLy3khU7wK7e7rJM+HF7lVfiLOs= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.fr; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=XfbNHt3vCs6gOuJy1KjyHd141UVIBRNSzAy9UyWLX5iCkGTclVLf+iQKufx5V7+zbIBE0HCdpZJzBLl6sQ25UhFXPpoJmfiTJ5AXBnzhEhVXMaMjZmxteRUVp15p3iKgQ/pi9Ppju/iHocQ/SPRraKjiXsEhne665JZBf5tflMo=; ---- Original Message ---- From: William Siegrist <wsiegrist(a)apple.com> To: Fabien Costantini <fab672000(a)yahoo.fr> Cc: Matt Rajca <matt.rajca(a)me.com>; darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Sent: Mon, November 30, 2009 10:48:18 AM Subject: Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source? >Did you file a bug for darwinbuild? I don't see one. > >-Bill No I didn't do that yet sorry, as the debug environment was what I really needed right now so I didn't look any further. Also, I was not a 100% sure was what going on with this build as it compiled correctly. I'll report that asap. -Fabien __________________________________________________________________ Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Alternative to bootstrap_register?
by Damien Sorresso 30 Nov '09

30 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On Nov 30, 2009, at 5:06 AM, Uli Kusterer wrote: > On 27.11.2009, at 18:40, Damien Sorresso wrote: >> Put it in ~/Library/LaunchAgents. launchd has per-user variants. Or is there some reason this job needs to run in a privileged context? > > We don't need a privileged service, not at all. The problem is that this code may get used from several applications, and each of these applications needs a different instance. So we're registering a dynamic service name. It seems very messy to create files on disk for this, which need to be maintained, changed and reloaded when our app gets updated etc. Ah I see. Maybe this facet of your use case got lost in all the other discussion. In any case, it sounds like bootstrap_register() is probably the most straightforward way for you to get there without having to have a parent spawn multiple helpers. If launchd ever implements multiple-instance job support, you can then just switch over to that. > Also, bootsrap_check_in() doesn't seem to let you check out again when the helper is no longer needed or our app gets updated. Correct. The idea is for launchd to hold onto the receive right after it's checked in. You can "check out" by unloading the job. > bootstrap_register() seems like such a clean way to achieve this, so I'd really like to know what it does wrong that it is being deprecated, and why we'd need to resort to hacks like plists on disk here. It all seems kind of arbitrary, and neither Apple's docs nor several questions on this and previous threads about bootstrap_register() ever got an answer why it is deprecated. It's not that is does anything "wrong". It's just that it's the old way of registering a MachService. The new way is through launchd. With bootstrap_register(), the client provides the bootstrap name server (launchd) with a send right, while it holds onto the receive right. Since with launchd, we want to encourage a launch-on-demand pattern, we have the MachService described statically in a plist. launchd then creates a receive right that it holds onto, so that when that receive right gets a message, we can kick off the job. And when the job dies, launchd will get the receive right back so it can be kicked off on-demand in the future. -- Damien Sorresso BSD Engineering Apple Inc. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by William Siegrist 30 Nov '09

30 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On Nov 30, 2009, at 9:01 AM, Fabien Costantini wrote: > Before you spend quite some time (like I did) building a new 10.6.2 kernel, > > I'd like to share with you that the new debug environment for 10.6.2 is indeed available with your ADC account (I thought it wasn't because I first looked at the public apple sources release site ...) > It solved the problem for me and saved me some precious time and energy ... > In case it helps someone in the future, I added a link to the debug kits for 10.6.x next to the tarball links for xnu on opensource.apple.com. > Now, if your really need a working custom build for the new kernel, > I believe you should try to get the latest recently modified kext_tools from apple because if you simply build the new kernel with the current svn darwinbuild, > you might encounter the timeout problems that had when building it for 10C540 due to unresolved external references. These problems will certainly be solved in the darwinbuild branch soo anyway. Did you file a bug for darwinbuild? I don't see one. -Bill _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by Fabien Costantini 30 Nov '09

30 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.fr; s=s1024; t=1259600507; bh=PzfeZHLPq4Lwg4ooJZNgqrr5SMuGinekkhMXp1OgEr0=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=t3s2a2Aoo1MaGRwjewSBop1HGhMBjJU5ybyw3BQ3nCi2yqzx+JIo1ZQPrrrZ37vX0HX5pomLCpGc/Y1Yp6IQseCmmj6/vgGwU1eqxXk3piLRxIFW9VyEZQJ4AOckdkDb7tlkGxf4n2HD0FHOW7+jbV3HwEC29cL3xOyrHBV0L6I= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.fr; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=lpC3nrKMUUrvlADF42BL7uv4NT6MASfLmZQswO0aXNHSiyzKyY2ow/O960XHcYpgUG0ekzBSde541ZORTltSzprG8IkIGGHSYydVBvycvbTcOfBbUHFBvODYCSs2WDtQEO1cHJVBXDB7jqOAwtmCGPhltTHIrl7gnNfGiWbK3ss=; Before you spend quite some time (like I did) building a new 10.6.2 kernel, I'd like to share with you that the new debug environment for 10.6.2 is indeed available with your ADC account (I thought it wasn't because I first looked at the public apple sources release site ...) It solved the problem for me and saved me some precious time and energy ... Now, if your really need a working custom build for the new kernel, I believe you should try to get the latest recently modified kext_tools from apple because if you simply build the new kernel with the current svn darwinbuild, you might encounter the timeout problems that had when building it for 10C540 due to unresolved external references. These problems will certainly be solved in the darwinbuild branch soo anyway. Hope this helps, -- Fabien ----- Original Message ---- From: Matt Rajca <matt.rajca(a)me.com> To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Sent: Sun, November 29, 2009 3:30:55 PM Subject: Building a bootable Darwin from source? Hi guys! I planning on trying to build a bootable Darwin from source, mostly as a learning experience. Does anyone have any experience doing something like this? If so, would you be able to briefly outline the necessary steps to get this done? Are there any potential problems I might run into? And lastly, does anyone know the most basic set of packages I need to compile to get this to work? I would assume xnu, BootX, etc... Thanks! Matt _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/fab672000%40yahoo.fr This email sent to fab672000(a)yahoo.fr __________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Alternative to bootstrap_register?
by Uli Kusterer 30 Nov '09

30 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On 27.11.2009, at 18:40, Damien Sorresso wrote: > Put it in ~/Library/LaunchAgents. launchd has per-user variants. Or is there some reason this job needs to run in a privileged context? We don't need a privileged service, not at all. The problem is that this code may get used from several applications, and each of these applications needs a different instance. So we're registering a dynamic service name. It seems very messy to create files on disk for this, which need to be maintained, changed and reloaded when our app gets updated etc. Also, bootsrap_check_in() doesn't seem to let you check out again when the helper is no longer needed or our app gets updated. bootstrap_register() seems like such a clean way to achieve this, so I'd really like to know what it does wrong that it is being deprecated, and why we'd need to resort to hacks like plists on disk here. It all seems kind of arbitrary, and neither Apple's docs nor several questions on this and previous threads about bootstrap_register() ever got an answer why it is deprecated. Cheers, -- Uli Kusterer "The witnesses of TeachText are everywhere..." _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by Stuart Crook 29 Nov '09

29 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Hi. _sjc_ On 29 Nov 2009, at 22:36, Dave Schroeder wrote: You may be interested in checking out the PureDarwin project: http://www.puredarwin.org - Dave On Nov 29, 2009, at 4:30 PM, Matt Rajca wrote: Hi guys! Thanks! _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/stuart%40echus.demon.co.uk _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… You'll find the minimum package list I put together at http://www.puredarwin.org/developers/puredarwin-core ... but bear in mind that this was for Darwin 9. I'm not sure how 10 is coming along. I planning on trying to build a bootable Darwin from source, mostly as a learning experience. Does anyone have any experience doing something like this? If so, would you be able to briefly outline the necessary steps to get this done? Are there any potential problems I might run into? And lastly, does anyone know the most basic set of packages I need to compile to get this to work? I would assume xnu, BootX, etc... Matt This email sent to stuart(a)echus.demon.co.uk This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by Dave Schroeder 29 Nov '09

29 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com You may be interested in checking out the PureDarwin project: http://www.puredarwin.org - Dave On Nov 29, 2009, at 4:30 PM, Matt Rajca wrote: > Hi guys! > > I planning on trying to build a bootable Darwin from source, mostly as a learning experience. Does anyone have any experience doing something like this? If so, would you be able to briefly outline the necessary steps to get this done? > > Are there any potential problems I might run into? And lastly, does anyone know the most basic set of packages I need to compile to get this to work? I would assume xnu, BootX, etc... > > Thanks! > > Matt _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com smime.p7s

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Building a bootable Darwin from source?
by Matt Rajca 29 Nov '09

29 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Hi guys! I planning on trying to build a bootable Darwin from source, mostly as a learning experience. Does anyone have any experience doing something like this? If so, would you be able to briefly outline the necessary steps to get this done? Are there any potential problems I might run into? And lastly, does anyone know the most basic set of packages I need to compile to get this to work? I would assume xnu, BootX, etc... Thanks! Matt _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Alternative to bootstrap_register?
by Damien Sorresso 27 Nov '09

27 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On Nov 27, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Uli Kusterer wrote: > On 20.11.2009, at 19:31, Damien Sorresso wrote: >> bootstrap_check_in() doesn't require root privileges. It only requires that you be advertising the named service in your launchd.plist. > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but the plist is static, and needs to be installed with root permissions by an installer. How would we generate a plist with a dynamic service name without root permissions? Trying to coerce bootstrap_check_in() and generating a file on disk for this purpose seems like a terrible hack to me. Put it in ~/Library/LaunchAgents. launchd has per-user variants. Or is there some reason this job needs to run in a privileged context? -- Damien Sorresso BSD Engineering Apple Inc. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Alternative to bootstrap_register?
by Alastair Houghton 27 Nov '09

27 Nov '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=alastairs-place.net; h= subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc: content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; q=dns/txt; s= aug07; bh=XLlKv8gsYCwBcBLzuFwa5NIPXu0=; b=U/0IE4vGYr3nrFDtYlbaXr x/wcc4rhKFZlHZTvRmE/re4nbnnCxzJ1FrS+8gws+zxOWBjS93hMJcIYzMsS+04w 7ENiLZ1uRBivYqLTRSzAlZhIO9nPQmX4HPFUxsJQVF2hNq9h0zZO83j1/5Ferscf 02WgZHfi7EkRgjmGSO/m4= On 27 Nov 2009, at 17:28, Uli Kusterer wrote: > On 20.11.2009, at 19:31, Damien Sorresso wrote: >> bootstrap_check_in() doesn't require root privileges. It only requires that you be advertising the named service in your launchd.plist. > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but the plist is static, and needs to be installed with root permissions by an installer. How would we generate a plist with a dynamic service name without root permissions? Trying to coerce bootstrap_check_in() and generating a file on disk for this purpose seems like a terrible hack to me. Doesn't launchd have per-user contexts in addition to the root context? So couldn't you e.g. stick the plist in ~/Library/LaunchAgents (for instance)? That doesn't require superuser privileges, right? Not sure which version(s) of Mac OS X it works for, mind. Alternatively, if you don't want to use launchd for some reason, presumably you could: 1. On 10.5 and earlier, use bootstrap_register(), which is known to work. 2. On 10.6 and later, use bootstrap_check_in() *without* a plist, which works even though it would have required superuser privileges on earlier versions? I haven't tried any of this, I'm just trying to come up with suggestions that might work. Kind regards, Alastair. -- http://alastairs-place.net _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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