August 2009 - Darwin-dev - lists.apple.com

Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Mo McRoberts 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 21:26, Brian Bechtel<brian.bechtel(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Arch and uname -p both return the processor family type, i386. (as opposed > to ppc or arm.) I think the rationale was that too many scripts depend upon > this behavior. This actually doesn’t make a huge amount of sense: something like config.guess will return 'i386-apple-darwin10.0.1', despite the fact that gcc will be (by default) targeting x86_64; anything which relies on the knowledge that "i386" is by default entirely 32-bit will therefore break. In contrast, most other x86_64 systems tend to be set up such that x86_64 is reported as the “system” architecture (where the kernel architecture is pretty incidental), and so you have a triplet of, say, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu. I’d be curious to know what would break if uname returned the user-space architecture (as targeted by the system compiler by default) rather than the kernel architecture. M. -- http://nevali.net _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Brian Mastenbrook 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com On Aug 30, 2009, at 1:21 PM, Terry Lambert wrote: _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… Actually it is because the NVRAM driver is built in the EFI. Not that I have any reason to actually want K64, but I wonder what the overhead of using a small hypervisor to virtualize access to the NVRAM would be. Thanks to the VT extensions it's perfectly possible to run a 64-bit kernel under a 32-bit hypervisor in this fashion. -- Brian Mastenbrook brian(a)mastenbrook.net http://brian.mastenbrook.net/ This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Dmitry Markman 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com thanks for the answer you're right it is unfortunate On Aug 30, 2009, at 4:26 PM, Brian Bechtel wrote: On Aug 29, 2009, at 8:25 PM, Dmitry Markman <dmarkman(a)mac.com> wrote: I found situation with 64 bit on Snow Leopard as quite confusing Dmitry Markman _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… 3. whatever kernel you booted from arch command always return i386 4. uname -m return x86_64 if you booted from 64 bit kernel, otherwise it returns i386 5. uname -p always returns i386 Arch and uname -p both return the processor family type, i386. (as opposed to ppc or arm.) I think the rationale was that too many scripts depend upon this behavior. uname -m tells you which slice of xnu you booted from, i. e. x86_64 for the 64 bit kernel, i386 for the 32 bit kernel. It's unfortunate that the phrase i386 has two meanings. This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Brian Bechtel 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:references:message-id:from:to :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-mailer :mime-version:subject:date:cc; bh=TGAAKDGtEzmrv1p7KfwvLtJYwJ0F2V5KBKc4Trcsqb8=; b=eltAXlGWXeDmbwbffiEv7wxLK9tbY5E4E193V5PMS3xv8LATnZOk37mkf35B5xGqTf ooDLorR5aPFPu6FXaGq5iu1chv79Wa0L5DC47kFAUEg9N3gZUTvPxlyEr2LTBfori3HW iTxCrpdIm6gcKqrKfcjSKUwa1R8aKb/ryoais= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=references:message-id:from:to:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:x-mailer:mime-version:subject:date:cc; b=sm2FoAuJ0UjPGz1b99RcH10934LCHsGCtxQDE9sjHbzHDNteVvqje73IdgoZ5sroAp +nOzVPjWhrieph0zPGvn5JY7y2xILnS4h4bo3ds/Ww+S2o2JnXpwEyUgMvL6XqzSHhPv 3gDFR50c3iIDG3PATN/RA8uTxTWoAykxZV8WA= On Aug 29, 2009, at 8:25 PM, Dmitry Markman <dmarkman(a)mac.com> wrote: I found situation with 64 bit on Snow Leopard as quite confusing It's unfortunate that the phrase i386 has two meanings. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… 3. whatever kernel you booted from arch command always return i386 4. uname -m return x86_64 if you booted from 64 bit kernel, otherwise it returns i386 5. uname -p always returns i386 Arch and uname -p both return the processor family type, i386. (as opposed to ppc or arm.) I think the rationale was that too many scripts depend upon this behavior. uname -m tells you which slice of xnu you booted from, i. e. x86_64 for the 64 bit kernel, i386 for the 32 bit kernel. This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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process exit status from kevent
by Ameen 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=44L5CwXjdV/sv107c2JsTIZUERZVHOPkpg/d7v72Id4=; b=YUSn6HpOIa3645MGU5+5KKrM/gAWsX0hRZC54rvtQTMtSmjxsAzxLrsUNQaivfkRAo Xz6Vt6o8ObAtPJxwlFDrA0ILkcqTe4lYpkinLN6UkqJuI+bJD/jW1W9aylFHJZDRlQMI gwyLXBiQ4zZ5Jx0sso1nxLkYw0qNQ9hm02XLc= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=L/a1LpTyy5CxSzbRdZViSCiPV8BUPFFwfCEyVu24WlF5GIotI9F/5KVM8hOsjFjOtG hjA5psafS6F5sNYEul5g2pzp84rsXhtLDz9ToIbxGC+ZoW6tlzRGVcsT8YFGU9Lly7mc icCvpITiCBHv3VVK0sgl4swGUJ+JZZjc+A9jc= User-agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (Macintosh/20090302) while monitoring the exit of an unrelated ( not parent child relationship ) process using kqueue - EVFILT_PROC - NOTE_EXIT, it would have been very convenient to fetch its exit status as well, like the way it is possible in FreeBSD (http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=kevent&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath…) kevent.data holds 0x0 on the Mac. man pages for kqueue/kevent does not mention anything about getting the exit status from NOTE_EXIT. am i missing something here or is it the way it is ? would appreciate any pointers. Thanks, Ameen. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Terry Lambert 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Eli Bach wrote: > > 1. The arbitrary limitation that if your computer 'only' as EFI32, > Apple prevents you from booting into the 64-bit kernel. MacOSX requires EFI64 to boot, probably because doing the bootstrap from 32- to 64-bit mode is a bit tricky. Actually it is because the NVRAM driver is built in the EFI. -- Terry This isn't really arbitrary, but it is annoying, and is typical of how Apple tends to punish early adopters. My test lab has a lot of the original generation Intel hardware (1st generation Intel Xserves and MacPros). All these machines run 64-bit Linux (and FreeBSD, and OpenSolaris) just fine, but none will run MacOSX in 64-bit mode due to not having EFI64. This irritated me greatly, especially since the hackintosh people are booting whiteboxes into 64-bit MacOSX. What I finally did was to use the hackintosh "pc-efi-v10" bootloader to boot into 64-bit MacOSX on our 1st generation MacPros, using the Linux partition's grub bootloader to launch the hackintosh bootloader. Its all very Rube-Goldberg-ish, and it has all the disadvantages of a hackintosh (no decent video support, etc). But for what I need (an x8 PCIe slot in Mac running a 64-bit kernel), it works well enough. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… On Aug 29, 2009, at 10:55 AM, Andrew Gallatin <gallatin(a)cs.duke.edu> wrote: This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Dmitry Markman 30 Aug '09

30 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com I found situation with 64 bit on Snow Leopard as quite confusing hope it will help On Aug 29, 2009, at 2:43 AM, rohan a wrote: Hello All, Now with the 10.6 Snow Leopard kernel being full 64-bit, will it require all applications to also be 64-bit ?Our application does not need to address > 4GB memory. We had developed a 32-bit application for Mac OS X 10.4 and 10.5. Would the same work on 10.6 without any changes or would it require to be recompiled for 64-bit ? Thanks _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/dmarkman%40mac.com Dmitry Markman _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… 1. default compiler is gcc 4.2.1 2. default binary that gcc compiler produces is x86_64 (you can always explicitly ask 32 bit via -arch i386 switch) 3. whatever kernel you booted from arch command always return i386 4. uname -m return x86_64 if you booted from 64 bit kernel, otherwise it returns i386 5. uname -p always returns i386 you can always to know whether or not your hardware is 64 bit capable by issuing command sysctl -n hw.cpu64bit_capable Will Mac OS X gcc compiler on Snow Leopard natively build 64-bit binaries ? This email sent to dmarkman(a)mac.com This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Andrew Gallatin 29 Aug '09

29 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com User-agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090608) Le 29 août 2009 à 19:55, Andrew Gallatin a écrit : Eli Bach wrote: > > 1. The arbitrary limitation that if your computer 'only' as EFI32, > Apple prevents you from booting into the 64-bit kernel. MacOSX requires EFI64 to boot, probably because doing the bootstrap from 32- to 64-bit mode is a bit tricky. This isn't really arbitrary, but it is annoying, and is typical of how Apple tends to punish early adopters. My test lab has a lot of the original generation Intel hardware (1st generation Intel Xserves and MacPros). All these machines run 64-bit Linux (and FreeBSD, and OpenSolaris) just fine, but none will run MacOSX in 64-bit mode due to not having EFI64. This irritated me greatly, especially since the hackintosh people are booting whiteboxes into 64-bit MacOSX. What I finally did was to use the hackintosh "pc-efi-v10" bootloader to boot into 64-bit MacOSX on our 1st generation MacPros, using the Linux partition's grub bootloader to launch the hackintosh bootloader. Its all very Rube-Goldberg-ish, and it has all the disadvantages of a hackintosh (no decent video support, etc). But for what I need (an x8 PCIe slot in Mac running a 64-bit kernel), it works well enough. Why do you absolutly need to boot on 64 bit Kernel ? Does you machine have more than 32 GB of RAM ? I write device drivers, and need to test the drivers under a 64-bit MacOSX kernel. Drew _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… Jean-Daniel Dupas wrote: This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Jean-Daniel Dupas 29 Aug '09

29 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Le 29 août 2009 à 19:55, Andrew Gallatin a écrit : Eli Bach wrote: > > 1. The arbitrary limitation that if your computer 'only' as EFI32, > Apple prevents you from booting into the 64-bit kernel. MacOSX requires EFI64 to boot, probably because doing the bootstrap from 32- to 64-bit mode is a bit tricky. This isn't really arbitrary, but it is annoying, and is typical of how Apple tends to punish early adopters. My test lab has a lot of the original generation Intel hardware (1st generation Intel Xserves and MacPros). All these machines run 64-bit Linux (and FreeBSD, and OpenSolaris) just fine, but none will run MacOSX in 64-bit mode due to not having EFI64. This irritated me greatly, especially since the hackintosh people are booting whiteboxes into 64-bit MacOSX. What I finally did was to use the hackintosh "pc-efi-v10" bootloader to boot into 64-bit MacOSX on our 1st generation MacPros, using the Linux partition's grub bootloader to launch the hackintosh bootloader. Its all very Rube-Goldberg-ish, and it has all the disadvantages of a hackintosh (no decent video support, etc). But for what I need (an x8 PCIe slot in Mac running a 64-bit kernel), it works well enough. Why do you absolutly need to boot on 64 bit Kernel ? Does you machine have more than 32 GB of RAM ? _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Mac OS X Snow Leopard and 64-bit applications
by Andrew Gallatin 29 Aug '09

29 Aug '09

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com User-agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090608) Eli Bach wrote: > > 1. The arbitrary limitation that if your computer 'only' as EFI32, > Apple prevents you from booting into the 64-bit kernel. MacOSX requires EFI64 to boot, probably because doing the bootstrap from 32- to 64-bit mode is a bit tricky. This isn't really arbitrary, but it is annoying, and is typical of how Apple tends to punish early adopters. My test lab has a lot of the original generation Intel hardware (1st generation Intel Xserves and MacPros). All these machines run 64-bit Linux (and FreeBSD, and OpenSolaris) just fine, but none will run MacOSX in 64-bit mode due to not having EFI64. This irritated me greatly, especially since the hackintosh people are booting whiteboxes into 64-bit MacOSX. What I finally did was to use the hackintosh "pc-efi-v10" bootloader to boot into 64-bit MacOSX on our 1st generation MacPros, using the Linux partition's grub bootloader to launch the hackintosh bootloader. Its all very Rube-Goldberg-ish, and it has all the disadvantages of a hackintosh (no decent video support, etc). But for what I need (an x8 PCIe slot in Mac running a 64-bit kernel), it works well enough. Cheers, Drew _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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