December 2010 - Darwin-dev - lists.apple.com

Re: next release (Lion) developer download
by Alexander von Below 03 Dec '10

03 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Am 04.12.2010 um 00:36 schrieb Esteban Vincenzi: > hi all, > > when will the next release will be available in the apple website? Are you talking about OS X the product, or Darwin? Darwin should be posted within a few days of the official OS X 10.7 release. There are no seed releases of darwin > do I have to compile the code? Apple does not offer binaries of Darwin. There are sites that do > will this process take more than 3 days? (test machine: Mac mini C2D, production/main computer: MacBook Pro) No. > _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/below%40mac.com > > This email sent to below(a)mac.com _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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next release (Lion) developer download
by Esteban Vincenzi 03 Dec '10

03 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=lavabit; d=lavabit.com; b=SnRTu4YYp54UPsciZ2oS0jt9U5vupLYGgyTgDOvPfGP4qJdgEcOWV5YrBJ3bf8Dn0VqICfXq1WSOP1dnHOpr632rOcx4AFaunoGf2tSp0sQ83GGl1dvvWJtbVO2bADe4wmO7YKmDOQkpn9FpI0Ul4DoIBH+Wlbvp42CytfBsEu8=; h=From:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To:Mime-Version:X-Mailer; hi all, when will the next release will be available in the apple website? do I have to compile the code? will this process take more than 3 days? (test machine: Mac mini C2D, production/main computer: MacBook Pro) _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: desktop replacement OS; Darwin/Webkit project
by Esteban Vincenzi 03 Dec '10

03 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=lavabit; d=lavabit.com; b=b2E8EM313Yn7W8pPJObgyVuTJvFtRAwRB6Q4UCkn3D0mBMWwcukdY8GOvHvQP56ZuvyLxUi4uULgcJ9yR8qCrFRWD1arYaFBM3UDqMw5xLlrJvSt5RpNEhJwSprT8MIQI9AUMRfACS6ckT4FEg12WKm8XZllP+yrSbPwhmBtC8M=; h=Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id:References:To:X-Mailer; For the record, my name is not legally as I use it on the Cloud. It should be another one. For english-based communications my name is Stephen Vincenzi. (for italian based: Stefano Vincenzi and for spanish Esteban Vincenzi). I prefer an attributtion/non-commercial license for this types of public (semiprivate because of the filter that is having a basic understanding of some concepts) communication. For historical computing archiving, I consider Mac OS X the first version of a merger between Unix and Macintosh. The second version should have at least to main branches: open (with about 3 small branches MAXIMUM, we don't want a linu'x ego-based schism) and private (Apple made, produced, marketed and sold version of the platform). I have limited the "OS Architecture" to a modified Webkit canvas manager that can support full native (assume's local access, doesn't assume a Cloud-based "networking experience") apps. This Canvas Manager can be loaded/booted from "the platform" (examples: an iPad, Darwin, a 3 year old computer with a custom kernel, a Net BROWSER, Mac OS X, Plan 9, a "jailbreaked" Wii). The CLI/power user, and GUI/? duality will be deprecated. There's Text (txt) and Image (img); for example you can write Unix commands in a PHP-like form... and you can use Image elements when doing technical troubleshooting. I mean, why assume users are stupid? The other forum is: http://www.ixda.org/ I have a username under ~ Vincenzi, but I can not give you the direct link (don't have it handy). But I haven't made a formal proposal, because it is a very differently focused forum. I don't like the "interaction" title; it is too loaded. I prefer Interface Design... and in my case I've branded the "work title" hacker of interfaces (as in ethical hacker... criminal hackers are different). But I don't like to openly use it. Il giorno dic 2, 2553 BE, alle ore 23:49, dan hitt ha scritto: > Thanks Jean-Daniel for your reply, including the > reference to Illumos, and Esteban for bringing > up this discussion of OS+gui in the first place. > > Two remarks here: > (1) there are lots of reasons why one might want > to start with Darwin (which is not to say that > the reasons stated for not starting with Darwin > are not all valid) > (2) i would like very much to discuss > OS+gui options for various free systems > (haiku, syllable, aros, or others, such as > Illumos which i was not familiar with), but > i don't think Darwin Dev is the right list---too > off-topic. So please recommend one or more, > and thanks! > > Now, as to point (1), any innovation you > come up with in the OS layer for whatever > project you're working on, you may want > to port to the Mac. After all, it is still > easy to write apps for the Mac so you'll > be able to easily expose your innovation > to a wide audience. > > And further, even if Darwin only runs > easily on Mac hardware, i'm not so sure > that is so bad for all purposes. After all, > the Apple desktop hardware at least always > seems to be well laid out and easy to > fiddle around with, and has a palpable > good quality. > > So i'm just saying it is not necessarily > a mistake to start off from Darwin. > > However, regarding (2) above, i would > like to find a forum in which all these > other OS+gui combos can be > compared with each other, so thanks > for any clues there. > > dan > > > > On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 3:54 AM, Jean-Daniel Dupas > <devlists(a)shadowlab.org> wrote: >> >> Le 2 déc. 2010 à 12:38, Esteban Vincenzi a écrit : >> >> because it is a challenge? >> "open source", or "free enough"? >> >> I mean "Open source". Lots of drivers and critical OS parts are closed >> source, like the Graphic drivers for instance. >> I'm curious to see how such Webkit based OS perform without any GPU >> acceleration support (and without OpenGL). >> >> The kernel should be Unix, it can be w-e Plan 9 uses as kernel. I chosed >> Darwin. >> >> The license that I will use is European Union Public License. >> Solaris is basically deprecated since Sun became part of Oracle. >> >> Maybe Solaris. Certainly not Illumos. ( http://www.illumos.org/ ) >> >> *BSD may be a nice second option... >> >> FreeBSD is AFAIK the most active BSD community, so I would probably go this >> way if I had to develop a modern OS and want to avoid linux. >> Using a "kernel" with partially available sources and no community to work >> on it is probably not the choice I would have done. >> >> Linux is a mess, and my project will not be "another Linux distro" (since it >> is an ego-based project, being named after its founder... Linux has some >> issues from the very beginning, by starting as a clone of a copy of Unix, I >> deem the Linux kernel [and the GTK/QT toolkits] unaceptable for a "Windows >> OS" deprecator). >> >> Il giorno dic 2, 2553 BE, alle ore 04:44, Jean-Daniel Dupas ha scritto: >> >> Le 2 déc. 2010 à 11:36, Esteban Vincenzi a écrit : >> >> hi, >> I have a project for an OS interface that replaces the desktop as metaphor. >> I have chosen Darwin as kernel, and Webkit as... canvas manager (deprecates >> windowing manager) >> >> >> Is there any reason you choose a kernel that is not open source enough to >> rebuild a working OS and that barely supports running on anything that is >> not a Mac hardware ? >> >> It is a dual design/software_development project; but I think the general >> architecture is sufficiently diagramed. >> >> I already know Java (love the language, hate the JVM) and was starting to >> learn C++ but consider it useless since I will use ObjC instead. >> >> Are there any "C book" (the one made by the original creators, which I'm not >> interested in learning) style link, book or other reference which I can read >> to learn ObjC? >> >> -- Jean-Daniel >> >> >> >> >> >> -- Jean-Daniel >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >> Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/dan.hitt%40gmail.com >> >> This email sent to dan.hitt(a)gmail.com >> _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: desktop replacement OS; Darwin/Webkit project
by dan hitt 03 Dec '10

03 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:in-reply-to :references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=Dtr9pfu+BPft1UDpn7ny2+3jUPtrPLJIavMOP1QlMo8=; b=gHg/tkyp+uwnpye7xZ9kdhDcFzw78O7Yy32yU89l8HOc8ZlwbOTdxcqNauU99xLLWs yZHsU0NY5xTWtQlI1FyQn5NXkYyMmacbfn+i4qrspOmguFOO45bfuIPB9dcx38dTgK7W 8fakH4ZzuucZllnPkZVtrMQ3J2WtewzvWITQQ= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=tK72acah4tKdDd1J2V/Ks8rOqM/VHLyi4dMx1FS1FdRG/cBuZIJeQr9Ne5jwA5Udmg Hv2Cln9DudoTRauIDUA9xr2Y+kIlzxVw04DX+MNFRHGTPBOhAIBle/8a76L3e7BJiAz3 9McNQ9QaQ0v4olv4KmfCYBfMctUWTEqpPgs4o= Thanks Jean-Daniel for your reply, including the reference to Illumos, and Esteban for bringing up this discussion of OS+gui in the first place. Two remarks here: (1) there are lots of reasons why one might want to start with Darwin (which is not to say that the reasons stated for not starting with Darwin are not all valid) (2) i would like very much to discuss OS+gui options for various free systems (haiku, syllable, aros, or others, such as Illumos which i was not familiar with), but i don't think Darwin Dev is the right list---too off-topic. So please recommend one or more, and thanks! Now, as to point (1), any innovation you come up with in the OS layer for whatever project you're working on, you may want to port to the Mac. After all, it is still easy to write apps for the Mac so you'll be able to easily expose your innovation to a wide audience. And further, even if Darwin only runs easily on Mac hardware, i'm not so sure that is so bad for all purposes. After all, the Apple desktop hardware at least always seems to be well laid out and easy to fiddle around with, and has a palpable good quality. So i'm just saying it is not necessarily a mistake to start off from Darwin. However, regarding (2) above, i would like to find a forum in which all these other OS+gui combos can be compared with each other, so thanks for any clues there. dan On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 3:54 AM, Jean-Daniel Dupas <devlists(a)shadowlab.org> wrote: > > Le 2 déc. 2010 à 12:38, Esteban Vincenzi a écrit : > > because it is a challenge? > "open source", or "free enough"? > > I mean "Open source". Lots of drivers and critical OS parts are closed > source, like the Graphic drivers for instance. > I'm curious to see how such Webkit based OS perform without any GPU > acceleration support (and without OpenGL). > > The kernel should be Unix, it can be w-e Plan 9 uses as kernel. I chosed > Darwin. > > The license that I will use is European Union Public License. > Solaris is basically deprecated since Sun became part of Oracle. > > Maybe Solaris. Certainly not Illumos. ( http://www.illumos.org/ ) > > *BSD may be a nice second option... > > FreeBSD is AFAIK the most active BSD community, so I would probably go this > way if I had to develop a modern OS and want to avoid linux. > Using a "kernel" with partially available sources and no community to work > on it is probably not the choice I would have done. > > Linux is a mess, and my project will not be "another Linux distro" (since it > is an ego-based project, being named after its founder... Linux has some > issues from the very beginning, by starting as a clone of a copy of Unix, I > deem the Linux kernel [and the GTK/QT toolkits] unaceptable for a "Windows > OS" deprecator). > > Il giorno dic 2, 2553 BE, alle ore 04:44, Jean-Daniel Dupas ha scritto: > > Le 2 déc. 2010 à 11:36, Esteban Vincenzi a écrit : > > hi, > I have a project for an OS interface that replaces the desktop as metaphor. > I have chosen Darwin as kernel, and Webkit as... canvas manager (deprecates > windowing manager) > > > Is there any reason you choose a kernel that is not open source enough to > rebuild a working OS and that barely supports running on anything that is > not a Mac hardware ? > > It is a dual design/software_development project; but I think the general > architecture is sufficiently diagramed. > > I already know Java (love the language, hate the JVM) and was starting to > learn C++ but consider it useless since I will use ObjC instead. > > Are there any "C book" (the one made by the original creators, which I'm not > interested in learning) style link, book or other reference which I can read > to learn ObjC? > > -- Jean-Daniel > > > > > > -- Jean-Daniel > > > > _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/dan.hitt%40gmail.com > > This email sent to dan.hitt(a)gmail.com > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: desktop replacement OS; Darwin/Webkit project
by Jean-Daniel Dupas 02 Dec '10

02 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: desktop replacement OS; Darwin/Webkit project
by Jean-Daniel Dupas 02 Dec '10

02 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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desktop replacement OS; Darwin/Webkit project
by Esteban Vincenzi 02 Dec '10

02 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=lavabit; d=lavabit.com; b=tG/4R5dor6L5HjLBWCy2DOP7UBNnXH2U7DacL0AVOZ1dbrGkSnSmKxLpwgrs4KT3mJVbj0gHbG9OHe5cSdW0NuFwSJ5FrC/2XVt9AEu99yvHR1CXBeTHR3mZ/xIjD2c6XSqEZCeZH580OdbYHaXsews4D1It73+HuzZUtYktxzA=; h=From:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To:Mime-Version:X-Mailer; hi, I have a project for an OS interface that replaces the desktop as metaphor. I have chosen Darwin as kernel, and Webkit as... canvas manager (deprecates windowing manager) It is a dual design/software_development project; but I think the general architecture is sufficiently diagramed. I already know Java (love the language, hate the JVM) and was starting to learn C++ but consider it useless since I will use ObjC instead. Are there any "C book" (the one made by the original creators, which I'm not interested in learning) style link, book or other reference which I can read to learn ObjC? hh, G. _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: circular log buffer
by Marc Majka 01 Dec '10

01 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: circular log buffer
by Joel Reymont 01 Dec '10

01 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:mime-version :content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding :message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=4KFulV6Gpa1v6Gls3YuuxKf6lHyiFQRaT8bhM/fiCss=; b=QRjwmyU7mFDgRo/W4gqdVWSM2If8pkHTc24Ojr2NVN9Ytw2YLw9oF9CLgxhC1JMu3n aNzol3/GfIz7USo+aZVVVTW2TTN9Htb8fH/WPpwtr/KNOoIBf9Pt+Gj3QixN7EM2kCbz JbCW2jkD7xz0a4YR+tcRmLrzooOccnKpcWlQo= Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; b=P6Pcm+McoxIjvu/X52NyssC8GDxDiD0bwV4sQ581x+OJBHTyml3TomLl2FuUQr3XeW 47ecSjnamRg4H5gQhzU718D5961xDisn5o+CiMX+zj6EYrdyuhLLEZ9xHIyhr/hrDamL xDSFH6fKCAgJaD7GZk5OicJpfN2xTne5Lev8k= On Dec 1, 2010, at 12:13 AM, Marc Majka wrote: > What OS version is this on, and how much is getting logged? 10.6.4 I think. > If it's sufficient to maintain a circular queue of messages internal to your app, you could allocate an array of aslmsg structures: This would be my preferred option. > asl_circular_queue = (aslmsg *)calloc(CIRCULAR_QUEUE_SIZE, sizeof(aslmsg)); > > and use asl_new() / asl_set() to make messages. Then hold them in the array > > asl_circular_queue[cursor] = new_msg; > cursor = (cursor + 1) % CIRCULAR_QUEUE_SIZE; Do I need to asl_new/asl_free for every asl_set or can a message allocated with asl_new be reused multiple times? Thanks, Joel --- http://twitter.com/wagerlabs _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: circular log buffer
by Marc Majka 01 Dec '10

01 Dec '10

site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com Delivered-To: darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Darwin-dev mailing list (Darwin-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/darwin-dev/site_archiver%40lists.app… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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