March 2017 - Installer-dev - lists.apple.com

Re: Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Stephen Kay 31 Mar '17

31 Mar '17

(responses inline) On 3/30/17 1:22 PM, "Mike Pullen" <mike(a)thepullen.net> wrote: >Stephen, >I don't think it's necessary, or even a good idea, to do things in >"public" places like /Applications as any given user. As long as the >installer requires admin permissions to install, the script should run >with admin permissions and should be able to remove those files. So, >there shouldn't be any need to masquerade as a console user for this-- if >there is a console user at the moment. OK, sounds logical. My problem is I really don't know (yet) much about shell-scripting so I'm kinda mimicking other script examples I've seen. If what you say is the case, then it seems that using this to open the folder is unnecessary?: #!/bin/sh if [ "$COMMAND_LINE_INSTALL" = "" ]; then /usr/bin/su $USER -c "/usr/bin/open \"$2\"/.." fi exit 0 ...and simply this should suffice (for the operation): open "$2/.." >I'll harp again: Are you absolutely certain that your app will never be >installed when noone is logged in (like, pushed by ARD or a software >deployment mechanism when the machine is at the login screen, or shutting >down)? Yes! I know you keep recommending that article, and if I was starting out with a new app I would follow it, but I just don't see how most of it applies to my situation. This is not an app that will ever be "deployed". I've delivered it and installed it this way for over 15 years now, and that's not a defense for bad practices (or what was once 'ok' but is now considered bad), but it's not worth the effort to redesign the whole thing at this point because I generally just do incremental updates as required to support it as a legacy app, which isn't very often. It's a niche application, bought by individuals and installed for one user on a personal computer. The fact that I've recently discovered that I was opening a resource file with write permission and it would fail for any other user except admin or 501, yet I never received a single report related to that issue in 15 years shows that it was probably never installed in any way other than a single user installing it on a personal computer for which he has admin privileges. This whole re-examination of my installer practices was only prompted by the fact that I always used VISE-X and MindVision has gone out of business, and I needed to find a different installer solution. Thanks, - Stephen > >(I don't wanna be a broken record-- I just hate to see anyone invest time >on an installer that would break any of the "Commandments of Mac >Packaging ><https://www.afp548.com/2010/06/03/the-commandments-of-packaging-in-os-x/> >"! There is no downside to embracing those commandments with every >installer... : ) > > >Mike > > > > > > > >On Thu, Mar 30, 2017 at 3:09 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > >My installation puts a folder inside /Applications that holds the .app and >some other support files (sorry, it's old). Within that folder, there is >another folder that holds a pdf Help File. > >The structure is like this (note spaces in names): > >/Applications/My App Folder/My App.app >/Applications/My App Folder/Help Folder/Help File 3.3.pdf > >So if you install the new version on top of an older version, all files >having the same names get replaced except for the Help File which has a >version number at the end of it. So the user can end up with several older >help files. > >So I wanted to have the post-install script that is attached to my .app >bundle delete any older Help Files. > >In testing this, this WORKS to delete an older file (if it exists, and if >not, who cares): > >rm -rf "$2/../Help Folder/Help 3.2.pdf" > >But I had gotten the impression that you should use sudo and the current >user for everything, as shown in most of the examples I've seen here. > >If I try this, it doesn't work: > > /usr/bin/su $USER -c "/usr/bin/rm -rf \"$2/../Help Folder/Help >3.2.pdf\"" > >I must have something wrong with the quoting, I tried it without quotes, >numerous variations of quoting and escaping etc., but I can't see it. Or >there's something I'm misunderstanding about the examples I've seen. > >Thanks, >- Stephen > > > > _______________________________________________ >Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/mike%40thepullen.net > >This email sent to mike(a)thepullen.net > > > > > > > - Stephen =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Stephen Kay Karma-Lab :: developers of KARMA http://www.karma-lab.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Stephen Kay 31 Mar '17

31 Mar '17

On 3/30/17 1:23 PM, "Karl Kuehn" <kuehn.karl(a)gmail.com> wrote: >If the older version was installed using a .pkg, then `installer` (even >when called by `Installer.app`) should be cleaning away any files that >were explicitly in the older version[1], but not explicitly in the newer >version. This does not take any files created in any installer scripts >into account, nor anything like data, cache, or preferences files created >in the use of an app. But for most cases this should just be taken care >of for you. Good to know, but... > If you are just switching to a /pkg from something else (e.g. Mindvision >Installer) then you are on your own. Yes, this. >[1] This seems to be done using the package receipts. To see what a >system thinks the files are for a given installed package use `pkgutil >--pkgs YOUR_PACKAGE_ID_HERE`. After trying this, I discovered it's actually 'pkgutil --files YOUR_PACKAGE_ID_HERE' - but thanks! - Stephen _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Conor Schutzman 31 Mar '17

31 Mar '17

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Re: Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Karl Kuehn 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

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Re: Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Mike Pullen 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

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Packages - deleting older files on newer installation
by Stephen Kay 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

My installation puts a folder inside /Applications that holds the .app and some other support files (sorry, it's old). Within that folder, there is another folder that holds a pdf Help File. The structure is like this (note spaces in names): /Applications/My App Folder/My App.app /Applications/My App Folder/Help Folder/Help File 3.3.pdf So if you install the new version on top of an older version, all files having the same names get replaced except for the Help File which has a version number at the end of it. So the user can end up with several older help files. So I wanted to have the post-install script that is attached to my .app bundle delete any older Help Files. In testing this, this WORKS to delete an older file (if it exists, and if not, who cares): rm -rf "$2/../Help Folder/Help 3.2.pdf" But I had gotten the impression that you should use sudo and the current user for everything, as shown in most of the examples I've seen here. If I try this, it doesn't work: /usr/bin/su $USER -c "/usr/bin/rm -rf \"$2/../Help Folder/Help 3.2.pdf\"" I must have something wrong with the quoting, I tried it without quotes, numerous variations of quoting and escaping etc., but I can't see it. Or there's something I'm misunderstanding about the examples I've seen. Thanks, - Stephen _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - how to make an uninstaller?
by Stephen Kay 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

Most excellent. Thanks! - Stephen On 3/29/17 5:22 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >I’d likely point you to Rich Trouton’s blog post that talks about >script-only packages, which has a huge amount of information that also >pertains to packages with more than just scripts. >https://derflounder.wordpress.com/2014/06/01/understanding-payload-free-pa >ckages/ > >Variable > >What’s Referenced >$0 >= >Returns the path to the script >$1 >= >Returns the path to the installer package >$2 >= >Returns the target location (for example: /Applications) >$3 >= >Returns the target volume (for example: /Volumes/Macintosh HD) > > > >On Mar 29, 2017, at 5:17 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > >Thanks. Does anyone have a link to a reference/list about installer >environment variables? > >- Stephen > >On 3/29/17 12:01 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: > > >$3 is an environment variable that exists for scripts executed by >installer, it refers to the installation volume. > >For example, if you had multiple partitions, and were booted to >MacintoshHD, but were installing to a partition named Storage; $3 would >resolve to “/Volumes/Storage”. In most traditional environments, $3 just >resolves to “/“, but it’s important to understand it’s use for more >specialized/exotic configurations. > >On Mar 29, 2017, at 11:56 AM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > >Ok, thanks - I get it. > >So in this example: > >## Is Foo installed? ## >if [[ -d "$3/Applications/Foo.app" ]] ; then > >Where is $3 coming from? I understand that $1 $2 $3 etc. are positional >variables. > >Thanks, >- Stephen > > >On 3/28/17 2:52 PM, "Stephane Sudre" <dev.iceberg(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >On Tue, Mar 28, 2017 at 11:30 PM, Mike Solin <mike(a)mikesolin.com> >wrote: >It¹s built-in to the shell. See 'man bash'. > > > >On Tue, Mar 28, 2017 at 2:28 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > >Thanks for the example! Excuse my ignorance, but what does '-d' >command >do? I've been trying to search for info on this, related to >shell-scripting, but couldn't find anything. > > > >To avoid reading more than 10 pages of the bash man pages to find the >answer: > > >http://stackoverflow.com/questions/59838/check-if-a-directory-exists-in- >a- >shell-script > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/conor%40mac.com > >This email sent to conor(a)mac.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - how to make an uninstaller?
by Stephen Kay 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

I see - of course. I was thinking it was a standalone app like the MindVision installers I'm used to, but it's just a document/program of sorts that gets run by a local built-in app. Thanks for clarifying that before I wasted any time on it. Just, that kind of confusing messaging bugs me, so I have to scratch my head a bit about it before I admit "it is what it is" and go with it. :-) I don't think the Munki or Jamf stuff probably pertains to my little niche app, since a) I have no idea what those are and b) it's not the type of app that would ever be "deployed" by a system admin to a bunch of machines - which I think is what you are talking about... Thanks, - Stephen On 3/29/17 5:49 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >I don't think that would help, because the resulting .pkg file would >still use the local copy of Installer.app on the client device. You would >have to deploy a modified version of Installer.app on all clients, but >then you would create the opposite problem, not to mention Installer.app >constantly being modified as part of OS updates. > >You could create and Installer plugin that runs the uninstall, you would >have complete control over that UI. But that's a lot of work for very >little gain. Honestly, in my experience it really isn't an issue that the >text is wrong. And as I've previously mentioned, as soon as you start >presenting "uninstall packages" via Munki or Jamf Slef Service or >something similar, it truly becomes a non-issue. > >> On Mar 29, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >> >> I'm wondering if it would be possible to edit an instance of the >>Packages >> app (i.e. edit the .nib files or .string files in the >> Packages.app/Contents/Resources) so that you had a version that you only >> use for creating uninstallers, where you fix the text to be more >>logical... >> >> - Stephen >> >>> On 3/28/17 6:30 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >>> >>> Less than ideal, certainly, but doable. You have 2 sets of users, some >>> won't read any of that stuff anyway (so likely won't even notice the >>> confusing descriptions), and and those that will (who you can educate >>> through a readme). >>> >>> You can mitigate some of those issues through use of a software >>> deployment tool like Munki, Jamf, or AirWatch, in which case the end >>>user >>> likely won't actually see the UI (as such tools present the installer >>> through their own store interface and then execute it via command >>>line). >>> >>> On Mar 28, 2017, at 6:18 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >>> >>>>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. >>>> >>>> I experimented a bit with this. The problem I see is that, even with >>>> making it a distribution and customizing the presentation using text >>>> files >>>> for the pane contents, assuming you name the .pkg something like Foo >>>> Uninstaller, you end up with cryptic messages that cannot be changed >>>> such >>>> as: >>>> >>>> Title of Window: Install Foo Uninstaller >>>> "Welcome to the Foo Uninstaller Installer" >>>> >>>> Installation Type: Standard Install >>>> "Click Install to perform a standard installation.... >>>> >>>> [Except this is an UNINSTALLER....] >>>> >>>> Button: INSTALL >>>> >>>> Password dialog: Installer is trying to install new software.... >>>> >>>> Button: Install Software >>>> >>>> Summary: The installation was completed successfully (at top, cannot >>>>be >>>> replaced). >>>> >>>> So it seems not an ideal method.... Unless I'm missing something... >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> - Stephen >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 3/25/17 5:58 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. I use the "preinstall" script >>>>> in >>>>> Packages to script out a removal of the files my install package >>>>>added >>>>> (this obviously varies greatly by software title). I then use a >>>>> "postinstall" script in Packages to script a 'pkgutil --forget" >>>>>command >>>>> for the package identifier of the install package. >>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 5:53 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> (Sorry, reposting with correct title). >>>>>> >>>>>> How does one write an uninstaller for a Packages installer? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> - Stephen >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>> Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>> >>>>>>https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/conor%40mac.com >>>>>> >>>>>> This email sent to conor(a)mac.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> > - Stephen =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Stephen Kay Karma-Lab :: developers of KARMA http://www.karma-lab.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - how to make an uninstaller?
by Conor Schutzman 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

I don't think that would help, because the resulting .pkg file would still use the local copy of Installer.app on the client device. You would have to deploy a modified version of Installer.app on all clients, but then you would create the opposite problem, not to mention Installer.app constantly being modified as part of OS updates. You could create and Installer plugin that runs the uninstall, you would have complete control over that UI. But that's a lot of work for very little gain. Honestly, in my experience it really isn't an issue that the text is wrong. And as I've previously mentioned, as soon as you start presenting "uninstall packages" via Munki or Jamf Slef Service or something similar, it truly becomes a non-issue. > On Mar 29, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > > I'm wondering if it would be possible to edit an instance of the Packages > app (i.e. edit the .nib files or .string files in the > Packages.app/Contents/Resources) so that you had a version that you only > use for creating uninstallers, where you fix the text to be more logical... > > - Stephen > >> On 3/28/17 6:30 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >> >> Less than ideal, certainly, but doable. You have 2 sets of users, some >> won't read any of that stuff anyway (so likely won't even notice the >> confusing descriptions), and and those that will (who you can educate >> through a readme). >> >> You can mitigate some of those issues through use of a software >> deployment tool like Munki, Jamf, or AirWatch, in which case the end user >> likely won't actually see the UI (as such tools present the installer >> through their own store interface and then execute it via command line). >> >> On Mar 28, 2017, at 6:18 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >> >>>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. >>> >>> I experimented a bit with this. The problem I see is that, even with >>> making it a distribution and customizing the presentation using text >>> files >>> for the pane contents, assuming you name the .pkg something like Foo >>> Uninstaller, you end up with cryptic messages that cannot be changed >>> such >>> as: >>> >>> Title of Window: Install Foo Uninstaller >>> "Welcome to the Foo Uninstaller Installer" >>> >>> Installation Type: Standard Install >>> "Click Install to perform a standard installation.... >>> >>> [Except this is an UNINSTALLER....] >>> >>> Button: INSTALL >>> >>> Password dialog: Installer is trying to install new software.... >>> >>> Button: Install Software >>> >>> Summary: The installation was completed successfully (at top, cannot be >>> replaced). >>> >>> So it seems not an ideal method.... Unless I'm missing something... >>> >>> Thanks, >>> - Stephen >>> >>> >>> >>>> On 3/25/17 5:58 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. I use the "preinstall" script >>>> in >>>> Packages to script out a removal of the files my install package added >>>> (this obviously varies greatly by software title). I then use a >>>> "postinstall" script in Packages to script a 'pkgutil --forget" command >>>> for the package identifier of the install package. >>>> >>>>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 5:53 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> (Sorry, reposting with correct title). >>>>> >>>>> How does one write an uninstaller for a Packages installer? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> - Stephen >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>> Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/conor%40mac.com >>>>> >>>>> This email sent to conor(a)mac.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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Re: Packages - how to make an uninstaller?
by Stephen Kay 30 Mar '17

30 Mar '17

I'm wondering if it would be possible to edit an instance of the Packages app (i.e. edit the .nib files or .string files in the Packages.app/Contents/Resources) so that you had a version that you only use for creating uninstallers, where you fix the text to be more logical... - Stephen On 3/28/17 6:30 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >Less than ideal, certainly, but doable. You have 2 sets of users, some >won't read any of that stuff anyway (so likely won't even notice the >confusing descriptions), and and those that will (who you can educate >through a readme). > >You can mitigate some of those issues through use of a software >deployment tool like Munki, Jamf, or AirWatch, in which case the end user >likely won't actually see the UI (as such tools present the installer >through their own store interface and then execute it via command line). > >On Mar 28, 2017, at 6:18 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: > >>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. >> >> I experimented a bit with this. The problem I see is that, even with >> making it a distribution and customizing the presentation using text >>files >> for the pane contents, assuming you name the .pkg something like Foo >> Uninstaller, you end up with cryptic messages that cannot be changed >>such >> as: >> >> Title of Window: Install Foo Uninstaller >> "Welcome to the Foo Uninstaller Installer" >> >> Installation Type: Standard Install >> "Click Install to perform a standard installation.... >> >> [Except this is an UNINSTALLER....] >> >> Button: INSTALL >> >> Password dialog: Installer is trying to install new software.... >> >> Button: Install Software >> >> Summary: The installation was completed successfully (at top, cannot be >> replaced). >> >> So it seems not an ideal method.... Unless I'm missing something... >> >> Thanks, >> - Stephen >> >> >> >>> On 3/25/17 5:58 PM, "Conor Schutzman" <conor(a)mac.com> wrote: >>> >>> I make a payload-free raw flat package. I use the "preinstall" script >>>in >>> Packages to script out a removal of the files my install package added >>> (this obviously varies greatly by software title). I then use a >>> "postinstall" script in Packages to script a 'pkgutil --forget" command >>> for the package identifier of the install package. >>> >>>> On Mar 25, 2017, at 5:53 PM, Stephen Kay <sk(a)karma-lab.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> (Sorry, reposting with correct title). >>>> >>>> How does one write an uninstaller for a Packages installer? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> - Stephen >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>> Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) >>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/conor%40mac.com >>>> >>>> This email sent to conor(a)mac.com >>> >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Installer-dev mailing list (Installer-dev(a)lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/installer-dev/site_archiver%40lists… This email sent to site_archiver(a)lists.apple.com

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