Re: Newbie question: forcing data format during saveDocumentTo:
Re: Newbie question: forcing data format during saveDocumentTo:
- Subject: Re: Newbie question: forcing data format during saveDocumentTo:
- From: email@hidden
- Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 23:32:54 -0700
I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one. I have been
designing software for very unsophisticated users for fifteen years
now, and in this case I want it absolutely clear that when they export
the data it is NOT a Save As... When two actions lead to completely
different results, they should not be lumped together. There are times
when an additional option can at least demarcate the straightforward
from the complex.
Plus, in my experiments over the last few days, when you define types
using NSExportableAs they are not available when the save panel is
invoked using saveDocumentAs (they are disabled in the popup menu).
They are available only for saveDocumentTo: actions. That could just be
something I'm doing, but it makes sense not to allow Save As for file
types the application can't read, since that file becomes the working
file. I believe the Cocoa boys gave us these two actions for a reason,
and carefully thought through the distinctions between them.
So for both semantic and operational reasons I want to make Save As and
Export (Save To) separate options.
My knowledge of how the two are implemented is really not an issue,
especially since I haven't figured that out the whole way yet. The key
is that the user will choose to export for entirely different reasons
than when they choose Save As. It is all about the "What they are
doing" decision. When they are exporting, they are doing something
different than when they are saving, and they are doing it for
different reasons.
I will allow that there are plenty of applications that include
less-capable file types in the save as dialog, along with the
appropriate warnings, and many of them work just fine. But in all those
cases the new version of the data is at least usable by the application
that just saved it. That is not the case here. Once that data goes out,
it's not coming back.
OK, enough of that. I'm afraid I may have come off as rather snippy;
sorry about that. That was not intended. I really do appreciate your
feedback. What was my question again?
Jerry
On Wednesday, September 3, 2003, at 03:37 PM, Alastair J.Houghton
wrote:
On Wednesday, September 3, 2003, at 05:36 pm, email@hidden wrote:
I am definitely Exporting; when saving as rtf I am only saving a
subset of the data. It is not a file that can be used to continue
working in my app. I don't want the user to have the slightest
indication that after exporting he can delete the original file.
You're missing the point Scott was trying to make. You shouldn't have
an Export option in your menu, because it doesn't mean anything to a
user... they will not know why they should Export rather than choosing
Save As. What you should do instead is make your Save As box detect
the file type they have chosen, and warn them if it doesn't support
all of the data that you need to save.
In general, when designing a user-interface, you should imagine a user
who:
* Isn't an expert at using a computer.
* Is more interested in what they are doing than in how they are
doing it.
* Is likely to become confused if presented with many options at
once, especially if they have very little guidance available as to
which one they want.
* Won't see distinctions based upon *how* the task they wish to
achieve is implemented (Export vs. Save As, or Save As vs. Save a
Copy, for example).
The distinction between Export and Save As is an artefact of the fact
that you know how they are implemented; if you did not, the
distinction would not be clear, so our hypothetical user will not know
which one to choose if they want to e.g. save a file as RTF.
Kind regards,
Alastair.
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