Re: Cocoa et al as HCI usability problem
Re: Cocoa et al as HCI usability problem
- Subject: Re: Cocoa et al as HCI usability problem
- From: Peter Duniho <email@hidden>
- Date: Tue, 20 May 2008 00:47:01 -0700
Date: Tue, 20 May 2008 04:26:08 +0200
From: Andreas Mayer <email@hidden>
Am 19.05.2008 um 22:36 Uhr schrieb Peter Duniho:
But not the sort of compelling "we really need the language to be
this way otherwise it just doesn't work" example I was hoping for.
There is no such example. As was already pointed out, you can do the
same things in every touring complete language.
It's "Turing". As in "Alan Turing". And you keep ignoring what I'm
saying. Just because two languages are Turing-Complete, that doesn't
mean that they will have equivalent implementations. The most basic
Turing-Complete language possible would have implementations for the
simplest of problems that are far too unwieldy to be practical, never
mind any interesting program.
Likewise, in comparing two different languages, they can still both
be Turing-Complete, and yet one can implement some behavior in a few
lines of code while the other could take hundreds to do the same thing.
I hesitate to put a specific ratio on my question, because as you
write...
So it's mostly a matter of what style you prefer.
...but I'd say that I'd expect an example significant enough to
justify the hazards involved in the Cocoa paradigm would reduce the
implementation size by _at least_ one order of magnitude.
I admit, there are lots of people who don't mind dangerous
programming environments. Some people even thrive on them. But me?
I've had enough of the danger. I've lived my life on the edge long
enough, and I'm ready for a nice, quiet language when it's available.
And finally, because this thread keeps heading down this path for no
real good reason, I really need to point out once again that whatever
problems I have writing Cocoa code, the issues in the language that
disturb me are REALLY minor relative to the other stuff. If Xcode
and IB and the documentation worked perfectly, I could easily
overlook how Objective-C works.
But as things are now, I can't help but mention those other things
when I find myself ranting about the tools and docs. :)
Pete
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