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Re: 64bit processing possible?
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Re: 64bit processing possible?


  • Subject: Re: 64bit processing possible?
  • From: William Stewart <email@hidden>
  • Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 12:49:37 -0700

ok - but I don't see why this is such an issue.

AUHAL is interfacing through the HAL to the audio driver. No audio hardware that I know of can even use all of the 24bits of resolution that can be represented in a 32bit float.

If you keep your whole signal processing chain as doubles (which you can easily do with audio units if you build your own) - and I am sure that there would be some 3rd party interest to add to this - you have at some point to go down to 24bit output (or come from 24 bit input).

So, exactly why is AUHAL a problem (or even a roadblock) here?

Bill

On Jul 29, 2009, at 12:27 PM, Evan Olcott wrote:


On Jul 29, 2009, at 2:04 PM, email@hidden wrote:


The best next step here is for some industrious developer to create a
double-precision AU host and go from there.  It's a bit of a chicken-
and-egg situation, but it would seem to start the ball rolling.

Coming from the host-development side (which we do with a small handful of our products, Rax in particular), I can tell you that we HAVE tried this and researched it, and our roadblock in the end is the AUHAL drivers. Even if we WERE able to make the entirety of the stream double precision, not only would we lose access to almost every commercial AU, it seems to be brought down to (at least) single-precision internally the AUHAL. We have yet to come across an AUHAL driver that supports a 64-bit AudioBasicStreamDescription as the input format. The drivers we've analyzed seem to convert their data streams to 24-bit integer on the outgoing side, so they take the single precision and convert that to a more efficient data stream. 64-bits with multiple channels is a pretty hot data stream - takes a wide pipe to push that all through.


That said, it's not like we've seen every driver out there. If there IS a double-precision clean AUHAL driver out there (that can be used by third-party developers like us), please let us know - we'd look forward to working with it. We'll be the guinea pig if it gets double-precision AUs written.

Also note: the 64-bit operating system will effectively obsolete VST support, as their interfaces are written (almost always) in Carbon. Carbon libraries are not available to apps that are 64-bit clean. We are going down the 64-bit clean path, as every app eventually will, and Carbon.framework will be unavailable. So unless someone (Steinberg?) finds a way to update the VST libraries to not access Carbon.framework, update their headers to properly use the 64-bit memory access (does VST3 do this?) and to use Cocoa GUIs instead of Carbon (up to the individual developers), VST plugs are a dead end. Audio Units seem to be the only path forward. If someone could prove me wrong, we would really really like to know.

Ev
Senior Software Developer
Audiofile Engineering

http://www.audiofile-engineering.com/







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 >Re: 64bit processing possible? (From: Evan Olcott <email@hidden>)

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