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Re: Picking up .wo changes
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Re: Picking up .wo changes


  • Subject: Re: Picking up .wo changes
  • From: Anders F Björklund <email@hidden>
  • Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2003 12:08:03 +0200

Anjo Krank wrote:

It all started when I had modified a component and was looking for the "reload definition"
method on the component... It seems that the current caching is either never or forever.

I get the impression that you want to change .wo files in the deployed application?
You can do this by overriding "template", but I wouldn't do this.

I wanted to change a .html file within a .wo bundle (within the .woa), yes.
And I did, and restarted ("deployed a new version of") the application...


Just thought it to be somewhat complex, for a rather simple modification ?

WO is *not* PHP. You don't go along and edit pages on your live server. One may argue if that can be streamlined, but in general, a WO app is and Application, not a distinct set of pages. Normally you do more than just edit the .wo (changing code etc) and you simply can't do this reliably on a live server. The normal way to cope with this is to add more quality control up front so you don't get used to this edit-the-live-app thing.

Quality Control ? They wanted to change a logo, and some color schemes...
(some of those were on static pages, and some had been "componentized")


I don't think it would be unrealistic to have a time-to-live on templates,
and then re-check the definition files to see if they were modified ?


I consider this partly bad, partly good: for tiny changes like editing some text, it seems overkill to have to restart the app. But on the other hand, in my experience it is better on your health and the discipline of your customer if you get them used to a more release-oriented workflow ("hey, add this edit box over here right now" ... "what do you mean 'that's not possible'? You also changed that text and those links the other day":)

That's just the problems with these three-tier web application servers, in my own not-so-humble opinion.
They transform the rather simple "website development" into the more complex "application development".


For instance, having the customer make the modifications themselves is totally out of the question.
Even if it's just a simple text file change to make, or a new color somewhere on a HTML sub-listing.


IMO, WO is a rather poor tool for building web sites because it integrates poorly with how a normal web site is supposed to work. But It is the arguably the best tool for building web *applications*, though. But when building apps, you also do things like write automated tests, version control, bug tracking, releases etc.

One of WebObjects problems, I suppose. Too complicated (and pricey) for simple websites,
and not enough for large web applications - compared to e.g. the Big Iron J2EE app servers?


Could be that the way Apple handled the WO 4.5 customers and releases left a bitter taste,
or that they are now with WO 5.2 up against a much larger selection of java-based servers ?


But it's hard for me to find a place for it, these days.

I just thought it would have been nice if WebObjects could pick up changes
in the templates (or in the java code or in the database) in an easy manner...

For the "java" part, you can look at my ERXCompilerProxy from Project Wonder. It recompiles classes on the fly. I don't know what you mean with "pickup changes in the templates"? WO does this already...and what is "in the database" supposed to mean?

Sounds nice, I'll check it out. With "changes to templates" I mean the .wod/.html files discussed here ?
With "changes in the database" I mean the whole EOF caching thing, and the workarounds involved there.
(i.e. defaultTimestampLag, changeNotificationFrameworks, invalidateAllObjects. that kinda jazz)
If you change either the database directly, or through EOs in some other instance - there is trouble.


--anders

PS. I'm not arguing against Model-View-Controller, or advocate mixing code and layout together.
Templates and DataObjects are very useful, no matter what the development environment is...
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 >Re: Picking up .wo changes (From: email@hidden (Anjo Krank))

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