Re: A "Why WebObjects" Site / Initial Thoughts Please
Re: A "Why WebObjects" Site / Initial Thoughts Please
- Subject: Re: A "Why WebObjects" Site / Initial Thoughts Please
- From: "Patrick Abuzeni, MD" <email@hidden>
- Date: Sat, 3 Jul 2004 10:33:12 -0400
This message was sent yesterday but erroneously was not sent to the
whole group.
Let me first say that I am NOT a developer, and I have been following
this list for the purpose of better understanding WebObjects, its good
and its bad and what it can do. Your typical client may not behave like
I do, but perhaps if I told you how things seem to me that you might
understand how a client views WO or your efforts.
But first a little background. I was interested in developing an
application for my business that seemed to fit the criteria for
WebObjects. I love Apple and therefore found myself gravitating towards
WO. I therefore researched it some more and bought a couple of WO books
and read them cover to cover. I literally fell in love with it. I was
blown away by it's cleverness. I then contacted Apple to validate
whether or not WO is the answer and Apple said yes. Every developer I
spoke to since suggested a WO-like application but without WO. Some
were even surprisingly ignorant of WO and what it is capable of doing.
Fortunately for all of us I was very persistent and insisted on WO
until I found someone that was capable.
Before I knew more about WO but still after reading the books and even
subscribing here, I found myself doubting whether or not WO would be
able to do any of the things I thought it was capable of. The main
reason for that is that too often many of the WO apps are referred to
as "WO-sites". Even after visiting Apple's website and reading all
there is on WO, it was hard to understand what it was capable of doing.
Developers like yourselves can probably visit a WO-website and
immediately appreciate the complexity and ingenuity of its design. But
not someone like myself. I cannot see that, and to me a "site" is a
website! So how do I justify spending that much more developing with WO
when it was going to produce a glorified "site"? Even when I knew it
was capable of something more than a "site", I couldn't find
information anywhere to ease my doubts. I found myself all the time
calling one of my contacts at Apple and asking "will it be able to do
this?" "How about this, that and the other?" It was very difficult to
get a clear picture and took a long time before I felt confident I was
making the right choice.
Ryan, I like your idea a lot. This community needs more live WO-app
examples, what they are, how they were developed and what they are
capable of doing. To answer your questions, I will do so in the order
they were presented:
A. Yes and again yes!
B. Anything visual is a must. I relied strictly on imagination and most
of all faith.
C. I think if successful, Apple may show interest. BUT if you can
figure out a way to show Apple how they can sell more Macs using WO,
then they will be flocking.
D. Don't know. My App is not finished yet. But it is possible to demo
it at a site like this. It is beyond the scope of this topic but I
would love to tell you more about it one day as it does break the
perceived mold (at least the "site" mold)
E. Pictures and lots of pictures. I mean illustrations of business
solutions. It is very difficult to graphically illustrate what a
business logic is, but most people will understand a solution and how
it may relate to their business or requirements. And just as
importantly, to illustrate what you as a developer see when you visit a
WO site. In other words, to graphically illustrate the complexity and
ingenuity of it's design.
In summary I was persistent and insisted on WO. But others would have
probably shied away. But I think I would have loved to have seen
examples of WO at work with live examples, visual aids and the sort.
And certainly the knowledge that the technology is going to be around
in the next few years would mean a whole lot. Also the talk of WO
becoming abandoned and the end the road for WO, makes me very uneasy.
So even if Apple does not follow through on your requests, you could
use the website to publish a Developer's Wish List. This List would
help illuminate a future for WO.
Best of luck
Patrick
On Jul 2, 2004, at 4:31 PM, Lotsa Cabo wrote:
> I would like some input. Who would be interested in contributing to a
> WebObjects advocate site? I may be willing to fund the effort if we
> have enough input and support.
>
> I've been giving this a lot of thought over the last few days. I love
> WebObjects, Apple, and all of the related technologies. I see many
> people, like myself, interested in the technologies but asking the two
> common questions...
>
> 1. Why WebObjects?
> 2. Is there a equivalent non-WO technology to do ____ ?
> 3. What is the future of WebObjects?
>
> While there are several sites out there that talk bout WO-related
> projects, and while the Apple site gives general marketing information,
> there is nothing that actually addresses these areas. I wonder if
> having a site devoted to this type of information, if it would be
> beneficial to the cause. Maybe something that offered demo apps and
> source? Maybe an area that reviewed technologies, compared them to
> WebObjects, and offered input?
>
> I would like thoughts on the following...
>
> A. Do you feel it would help people learn about WebObjects?
> B. Do you think new info would help consultants and developers "sell"
> the idea to new clients?
> C. If successful, what are the chances of getting official input from
> Apple down the road?
> D. What would you be willing to personally contribute (an app, source
> code, review technologies, etc.)?
> E. What items do you feel would be good on a site like this?
>
> I want to see Apple prosper and grow WebObjects. I would like to open
> up communication between the world and the WO developer community. I
> would like to see developers have enough "ammo" to successfully pitch
> and land a WebObjects project. Most of all, I would like to build
> something that will eventually get Apple to open up a tad-bit more.
>
> Any input or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Regardless of
> how small or extensive your reply, I would like to know your thoughts.
>
> Thanx,
> Ryan
>
> _________________________
> Tired of spam? Signup for a FREE SpamJammer.Com account and say
> goodbye to junk email forever!
> _______________________________________________
> webobjects-dev mailing list | email@hidden
> Help/Unsubscribe/Archives:
> http://www.lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/webobjects-dev
> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored.
_______________________________________________
webobjects-dev mailing list | email@hidden
Help/Unsubscribe/Archives: http://www.lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/webobjects-dev
Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored.