Re: copy and paste between X11 and native apps
Re: copy and paste between X11 and native apps
- Subject: Re: copy and paste between X11 and native apps
- From: Rich Cook <email@hidden>
- Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 10:52:43 -0700
Sorry to be obtuse, but how do I file a bug report with Apple again?
Thank you.
I would be shocked actually if this wasn't yet filed, as it has been
mentioned on this list numerous times.
On Oct 12, 2004, at 12:46 AM, John Davidorff Pell wrote:
You are quite right. XEmacs appears to hijack the X CLIPBOARD.
Actually, it appears that X11.app screws clipboard handling in
general, with respect to -c after explicit set of X CLIPBOARD. Its
understandable how this can get messed up, the whole
PRIMARY/SECONDARY/CLIPBOARD issue is ugly and confusing.
I've never run into this problem, but now that you've pointed it out
I'm wondering how I've overlooked it... Basically, any (XEmacs, GNOME
or KDE) explicit set of the X CLIPBOARD disables -c temporarily...
That's Bad™
File a bug or feedback.
As I mentioned before, your best bet may be to use something like
xcutsel or autocutsel (These both work inside X, to merge the PRIMARY
and CLIPBOARD buffers) until Apple fixes this.
JP
On 11 Oct 2004, at 19:35, Rich Cook wrote:
Well, actually, the situation I exeperience is slightly different
from what you describe. Actually, if xemacs has placed something into
the clipboard, then the selection from an xterm never makes into the
clipboard. Ever, ever, ever, no matter how many times I select and
copy or how long I wait. X11 just ignores the selection for purposes
of pasting into Aqua, and always, always, always pastes what I copied
from xemacs, forever and ever. However, if I copy something in
xeamacs then turn around and immediately select in an xterm and then
option-click into xemacs, even xemacs recognizes it as the selection
and pastes it in correctly! But Aqua does not. So Aqua may be in
perfect synchrony with some weird clipboard thing but it does not act
consistent with X11 applications, in that for X windows application,
the current selection always trumps the xemacs selection, but as far
as X11.app is concerned, xemacs' copy rules the universe!
Let me put it this way: why should what I have copied in xemacs
override what I have selected in the xterm, when this is not the case
for other X11 applications, including xemacs itself?
Example to illustrate:
Copy text from xemacs. Now make a selection in an xterm and type
Command-C. Option-click in xemacs. What gets pasted in? Hmm, it's
the xterm selection, not the xemacs selection! Ok, now paste in
Aqua. What gets pasted in? Huh! It's what was copied from xemacs!
Why are they different? This is what I'm talking about. Even xemacs
knows to paste the current selection.
Also, it is not a matter of waiting for a few or many seconds. I
have come back after playing volleyball for an hour and still had
xemacs owning the selection, clipboard, or whatever the hell it is.
It just "takes over." The ONLY way to "fix things" is to copy
something in Aqua, which "overrides" xemacs' death grip on the
clipboard situation. Then selections in the xterm become the
clipboard contents automatically, just as they normally do. It never
takes any time at all for me to have the selection get "copied to the
clipboard."
Another example will illustrate what I mean:
Copy text from xemacs. Now make a selection in an xterm and hit
command-C. Now go to Aqua, and select and copy some text. Go back
to the xterm. The selection is deselected. Hmm. Now select it
again and type Command-C again. Do a command-V paste in Aqua. The
selection is pasted! So copying in Aqua somehow "fixed" the
X11.app's idea of what is more important. Before copying in Aqua,
what I copied in xemacs always got pasted in Aqua. But after that, I
could select in xterm and copy/paste to Aqua again.
'Splain that! :-)
On Oct 11, 2004, at 7:15 PM, John Davidorff Pell wrote:
You are entirely correct, *neither* PRIMARY or SECONDARY are the
clipboard. You'll notice the same behaviour you just described in
any GTK or QT app, because the CLIPBOARD has nothing to do with
current selection.
the Aqua clipboard is sync'd with the X clipboard perfectly. If you
copy something in [X]Emacs (or any GTK/QT/"good" app) then it goes
into the clipboard. This has nothing to do with selection. When you
select something, it goes into PRIMARY (or SECONDARY). This has
nothing to do with the clipboard.
This is obviously confusing, annoying, and ridiculous... but its
build into X. It has nothing to do with Aqua at all, believe it or
not. (The fact that Aqua and X share the CLIPBOARD makes it
confusing, though.)
When you do -C, or select Copy form the Edit menu, X11.app takes
whatever is in the PRIMARY buffer, and copies it into the CLIPBOARD.
This takes a few seconds (for no good reason) and is the problem
that you are seeing.
There are several ways to sync the CLIPBOARD and PRIMARY if that is
what you want. there is xcutsel, which gives you convenient buttons
for copying CLIPBOARD-to-PRIMARY or PRIMARY-to-CLIPBOARD. This,
again, has nothing to do with Aqua, but X's numerous
clipboard-like-buffers. You can also try, autocutsel, which tries to
do this automatically (and works quite well, actually), but it
sometimes messes things up when you explicitly copy something, then
select something, and try to get back what you copied... its gone,
replaced by what you selected.
If anything is not clear, I'm happy to elaborate. :-)
As you say, what "seems" to be the clipboard in X is not what Aqua
view as the clipboard: What seems to be the clipboard in X is not
what X views as the clipboard either. If you don't like it, then
take it up with the X people... :-(
JP
On 11 Oct 2004, at 18:16, Rich Cook wrote:
Howdie,
What I mean is, that if I use xemacs and copy some text from
xemacs, then make a selection in an xterm window, then try to paste
into Aqua, the text I copied from xemacs shows up, not the text I
selected in the xterm. However, if I option-click in the xterm
instead of pasting into Aqua, the text I selected gets pasted, not
the text from xemacs.
I honestly don't know PRIMARY from SECONDARY, but what seems to be
the "clipboard" in X11 is not what Aqua views as the "clipboard."
--
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Sun-God robes, on a pyramid, with a thousand naked women screaming
and throwing little pickles at you? ... Why am I the only one who
has that dream?"
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