• Open Menu Close Menu
  • Apple
  • Shopping Bag
  • Apple
  • Mac
  • iPad
  • iPhone
  • Watch
  • TV
  • Music
  • Support
  • Search apple.com
  • Shopping Bag
 

Lists

Open Menu Close Menu
  • Terms and Conditions
  • Lists hosted on this site
  • Email the Postmaster
  • Tips for posting to public mailing lists
Re: List Header complaints
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: List Header complaints


  • Subject: Re: List Header complaints
  • From: Chuq Von Rospach <email@hidden>
  • Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 09:23:41 -0800

At 10:00 PM -0400 11/1/00, John MacDonald wrote:

a) This link isn't clickable (missing 'http://':

List-Id: Help and discussions for scripters developing scripts and solutions in AppleScript. <applescript-users.lists.apple.com>

List-ID isn't intended to be clickable. It's there to identify the list uniquely for scripting and filtering purposes. That's the correct format for it, and you can look up the RFC if you want to find out more about it.

b) *IF* a list of links is required with every post, it should be placed at the bottom of the message (as mentioned by others).

Not possible, because they are mail headers, and headers can't be placed in the body of the message.

The RFC for the list-* headers is RFC 2369. the purpose of those headers is to allow people who run mail lists to embed information so that mail clients can automate process for their end users -- whether it's setting up an "unsubscribe" button or creating a URL for a user to click to get list help. it's a new standard, but it solves a HUGE problem for mail list systems, which is how to help users get access to list-administration options, since we all know pretty much the only people who DO keep those "welcome" messages are the people who don't need them anyway.

Support for these headers in clients is still primitive at best, but it's a new, important standard, and if the list servers don't support it, there's no impetus for the mail client authors to do so, so MLMs like Mailman have to (and are) taking the lead in making that information available -- even on the internet, adoption of new functionality takes time. The added overhead is trivial compared to finally having a single, standard way of documenting these necessary data pieces and doing so in a way that allows automated use of that data for our non-techie/naive users.

The nice thing is, if you really, really want that, you have the ability to do things on the client end to do it. This would be pretty trivial to do with procmail, for instance. But I don't think we should gut things on the server end to the lowest common denominator ("let's not do anything anyone doesn't like") because we might as well shut down and go home.

these headers are a new, emerging email standard. I'd like to suggest you get used to them, because I think over the next year or so, they'll become very common as MLMs add the feature and sites upgrade to the new software.

E-mail is a very dynamic area of the internet right now. It's scary how much it's changed in the last two years (he says, as a person who makes his living trying to keep up with it). This is just one piece of it, but it's a huge one in the long term, because it allows us to help build tools for those that don't know the techie details enough to do these things for themselves - and that's a huge problem with mail lists right now.

c) A list mechanism that won't support styled text (something that would very useful to the list's members) shouldn't be cluttering up the system with a lengthy header.

Except -- we WILL be supporting styled text, as soon as I can do it safely. All the hooks are there, the mising piece is the anti-virus coding.

My advice: Instead of the link header, provide a footer with a single link to a web page that features the many links available and possibly, if the list must cater to the email-only crowd, a 'mailto' link that sends return mail with the current list of lists.

that's not posible and be in conformance with the new standards.

--
Chuq Von Rospach, Apple Mail List Gnome
(mailto:email@hidden) + (mailto:email@hidden)


  • Follow-Ups:
    • Re: List Header complaints
      • From: John MacDonald <email@hidden>
References: 
 >List Header complaints (From: John MacDonald <email@hidden>)

  • Prev by Date: Re: FMP question
  • Next by Date: Re: List Header suggestion
  • Previous by thread: Re: List Header complaints
  • Next by thread: Re: List Header complaints
  • Index(es):
    • Date
    • Thread