Cocoa downgrade from openstep?
Cocoa downgrade from openstep?
- Subject: Cocoa downgrade from openstep?
- From: Eric Peyton <email@hidden>
- Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 11:08:27 -0500
On Wednesday, August 8, 2001, at 10:45 AM, Erik M. Buck wrote:
I don't know how much you use Cocoa, but it is significantly
downgraded from
Openstep 4.2 in many respects.
Wow - as a huge Cocoa advocate, I had not noticed this. (blinded
by my own love for the platform? :-) ) Could you elucidate on which
classes and what functionality has downgraded for you? I have
found that Cocoa has improved substantially since the OpenStep
days. The addition of things like NSTabView, NSDrawer,
improvements to NSApplication, the addition of CoreFoundation,
NSDocument* and NSWindowController, NSOpenGLView, all the new image
support (via Quicktime), NSSpell*, NSToolbar, etc. seem like a
little more than "some features".
(And to note, no additions to the Cocoa frameworks that I have seen
fundamentally break code from the "good old days". I still have
one application that I cross-compiled on Rhapsody Intel, and except
for package changes I had to make still ran on OS X 10.0.x)
Apple has introduced huge performance
problems (perhaps due CoreFoundation) and lots of new bugs.
I doubt the CoreFoundation has added in any serious performance
problems, but do you have some concrete numbers (samples? gprof
data? etc.) that could help the Cocoa team track down why their
stack has "significantly downgraded"?
If you have indeed filed performance issues with Apple, do you
happen to remember what the radar numbers of those filings are?
(Most of CoreFoundation is open source, so actually identifying
where and how these problems are creeping in, if in fact they are
in CoreFoundation, would be wonderful.)
The largest performance hit I have noticed in Cocoa applications is
the fact that all Cocoa applications are also Carbon applications
and all Cocoa and Carbon frameworks (necessary) are loaded in. But
this can be mitigated and is in actuality mostly startup
application cost, not the kind of performance problems you claim
below.
To be fair,
Apple has added some features, but of course none of the new
features are
documented.
One reason that Apple may be reluctant to deliver the promised
YellowBox for
NT is that Cocoa has new performance problems. Our high end animation
application runs at twice the frame rate on a 266 MHz Pentium II
than on a
450 MHz G4 using substantially the same application code. It would be
embarrassing if applications ran twice as fast on machines that
cost 1/4 as
much as Macs.
A high-end animation package is not necessarily the same as a
standard "user application" but I would assume that if the problems
you mention are truly in places like CoreFoundation, then all
Cocoa apps would be experiencing the same kind of slow down. I am
very interested in numbers if you have them.
Eric
----- Original Message -----
From: "Simson L. Garfinkel" <email@hidden>
I'm confused; we had an ObjC++ compiler back in 1993; why is it
gone now?
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