Re: Jeff Lamarche: Public Enemy #1
Re: Jeff Lamarche: Public Enemy #1
- Subject: Re: Jeff Lamarche: Public Enemy #1
- From: email@hidden
- Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 15:27:50 -0700
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This is the kind of garbage that turns most people off to programming!
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Jeff could have easily disagreed respectfully without this gratuitous
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display of his superiority. He detailed response proves that he does
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not even know what "inane" means. He may have found my arguments to be
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wrong, ill-conceived or impossible to realize, but obviously he found
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enough substance to disagree with that the word "inane" cannot apply.
First of all, I have never held myself out to be an "expert" on this list;
merely a fellow traveler on the road to Cocoa proficiency. The meaning of
the word inane is one that I am quite familiar with, and was quite
appropriate under the circumstances. The best synonym I can think of for
"inane" in the context I used it is: silly. You wouldn't suggest that
someone learn to drive on a big rig, or learn to fly in a commercial jet?
Such a comment would be deemed "inane" by almost anyone. Yet, in your
posting, you recommended that people NOT learn the basics of programming,
but rather jump right into an advanced development environment that makes
heavy use of some pretty sophisticated concepts. How could this possibly be
seen as anything other than silly?
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The attitude of the experts here should be one of encouragement and
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edification of the lesser minds. Rather, I am seeing a concerted effort
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to drive away potential competitors. This is certainly flawed thinking
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since Cocoa and Objective-C represent such a tiny part of the
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programming spectrum that new programmers are necessary to allow Cocoa
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to survive and even to flourish. Pedants who drive away newbies are
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actually cutting their own throats and looking like jackasses doing it,
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instead of enhancing their worth and looking like heroes.
False encouragement is worse than false modesty. Encouragement without honesty
is downright sadistic. You can't jump in to Cocoa with both feet if you don't
understand the basic programming syntax and concepts upon which it is built.
Many programmers with moderate programming skills have been overwhelmed by
Cocoa, someone without any programming knowledge can't help but be.
There is no attemt by anyone here to drive away newbies. Ask a specific
newbie-esque (even inane) technical question and it will be answered quickly
and politely unless you pad the post with unnecessary attitude about Apple or
the "experts" on the list or how the world owes newbies more tools and
information targeted at the them.
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As far as the rest of Jeff's post is concerned, I'd like to let him know
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that the paradigms of learning in every field from reading to math to
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languages have historically undergone dramatic changes. Pioneers of new
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methods are routinely pilloried by the establishment. Computer science
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is not immune to such change.
Okay, I'm sorry, but my lesser intellect just got lost and I'm tempted to pull
out that word again (inane). What has this got to do with anything? Paradigm
shifts rarely justify ignoring history or ignoring it. Do you think that in Art
schools they now ignore artwork created before the digital age, simply because
most illustrators are working digitally? New paradigms always build on old
ones. It is not coincidence that we use "desktops" and "folders" on our
computer. On top of that, I fail to see how suggesting that new programmers
start with the basics before trying to program in Cocoa has anything at all to
do with a paradigm shift. You haven't suggested a new paradigm; you have merely
encouraged people to be ignorant of most of the fundamental skills necessary to
Cocoa programming.
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Let us all make an effort to remain civil, disagree respectfully and
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help each other generously. Otherwise, this may become an exclusive
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club of elite developers of a dead environment.
Hmmm. I called your argument inane, which was an honest opinion of its merits.
That's hardly flaming or uncivil, and I'd have to say that within the
limitations of my own knowledge, I've been as generous as I can be in this
group. Your advice, IMHO, was extremely bad and I thought it posed a risk to
those new to programming. I'm sorry that you don't agree, but I felt a strong
wording was necessary and appropriate because your advice was, well, inane.
Jeff