Re: Turn off color management!
Re: Turn off color management!
- Subject: Re: Turn off color management!
- From: Roy Harrington <email@hidden>
- Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2016 10:01:11 -0800
Ernst's assessment is pretty accurate. Maybe I can add some more.
I think the basic issues of printer profiling arise from a "who's in
charge" problem.
With 3 main players it's hard to get a consensus where things should happen
--
there's the Application, the OS, and the Printer driver. They all play a
role.
Up through Photoshop CS3 it was mostly Adobe's realm. PS had NoCM as well
as PS manages color.
The OS in those days (32 bit) stayed out of the way mostly -- actually
mostly the graphics
system was involved not the guts of the OS.
With the start of 64-bit lots of new things happened. Only Apple's Cocoa
supported 64-bit so
Adobe needed to re-do lots of PS -- screen graphics and printer output.
Apple took a much
stronger role in Color Management. Essentially everything that passes
through the standard
print system is Color Managed. Getting it right took a lot of "right"
choices by the user.
I'd say both Apple and Adobe tried to simplify what the user could do to
make it more
fool-proof. But that also made it harder for the custom professionals.
I got involved because even with the right choices, correct ICC grayscale
printing became
impossible with new versions. I spent hours with Apple developer(s) trying
to figure
it out -- what could I do or what I could get Apple to do. At least I
learned a lot on how
things did work even if I could not just change my QTR driver to make it
work. This
is how my Print-Tool came about.
With the current state of affairs the only way to get stuff through the
print system untouched is via
the null-transform method. This can be done this manually given you know
what's
happening under the hood, or the app can do it by knowing and looking at
internal info
passed up from print driver and OS. Seems messy and delicate but works at
least for
many cases -- Epson drivers. Seems not to work for Canon until recently.
Roy
On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 1:42 AM, Ernst Dinkla <email@hidden> wrote:
> Good morning Uli,
>
> The threads on several forums started in the winter of 2008-2009 with the
> Snow Leopard introduction. Summer 2009 Snow Leopard could be purchased and
> a wider group became aware of the issues. Adobe created ACPU in 2010 after
> the null profile method was lost when Adobe adapted its applications
> (including Windows applications 8-) to the new Colorsync policy. Microsoft
> indicated it might follow OS-X on this path but luckily never did. Some
> animosity between Apple and Adobe at that time probably caused more havoc
> and Adobe was slow in its response to the problem. The printer driver
> manufacturers were slow as well on the changes, I can only think that Apple
> should have informed those parties way earlier so this could have been
> solved right away.
>
> Two years later, with Lion in 2011 this Colorsync feature was added. During
> that 2009-2011 period Apple did not give a hint what was coming, at least
> not in this forum. No OS-X here in this shop so never had a chance to dig
> for an unknown feature :-) End of 2013 I did see the message in DPreview
> describing the Colorsync feature. Of course anybody who had a professional
> interest in profile creation already had the solutions to overcome the
> problem Apple/Adobe created. Dedicated profile creators had their own path
> to the printers (but not all), ACPU was there, Roy Harrington added his
> Print Tool. With Apple not advocating this feature even in its own
> Colorsync forum and meanwhile other apps available I am not surprised it
> was unknown here. Apple's aim at foolproof color management probably called
> for an obscure spot to hide it, plus some secrecy in documentation and
> publishing. On the other hand the Colorsync list is not really a gathering
> of color management fools .... you may think otherwise.
>
> I am interested in color, using Windows + Qimage Ultimate though, and never
> have been an OS-X user so this issue was something that I could look at
> from the fence but at least I could help some friends and customers with
> working bypasses.
>
> In my view both Apple and Adobe neglected the color management pros etc in
> a big way. There was a time Apple was at the front of color management
> developments, this sure wasn't the highlight since. It has been excentric
> in more of its developments, some paid off, some didn't, another example of
> the last was the Safari color management as if the internet was
> transferring OS-X sourced images only, that has been brought back to
> mainstream sense now.
>
>
> Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
>
> Dinkla Grafische Techniek
> Quad, piëzografie, giclée
> www.pigment-print.com
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 4:34 PM, Uli Zappe <email@hidden> wrote:
>
> > Am 03.03.2016 um 15:41 schrieb Ernst Dinkla <email@hidden>:
> >
> > > I can not recall that that feature has ever been mentioned at the time
> > when the first reports came that target printing in OS-X was gone.
> >
> > What time do you refer to? The feature was added in OS X 10.7. Lion, it
> > certainly wasn’t there in OS X 10.0.
> >
> > In previews of the upcoming OS X Lion, several (German) reviews of the
> new
> > OS X version pointed out this feature as one of the important new
> features
> > for professionals.
> >
> > Apart from that, as somebody who is interested in color reproduction, one
> > of the first things I do when a new OS X version appears is check out new
> > features in ColorSync Utility. I would have thought that other people
> > interested in color would do the same.
> >
> > > Not on this list, not by Apple representatives on this list or
> > elsewhere. Adobe took some months (maybe half a year) to bypass the OS-X
> > interference on profile free target printing with an application that did
> > not function properly either.
> >
> > That Adobe has no clue when it comes to OS X is nothing new. But that
> this
> > list is not aware of important features in the eponymous application is
> > somewhat strange, indeed.
> >
> > Bye
> > Uli
> > _________________________________________________________________________
> >
> > Uli Zappe, Christian-Morgenstern-Straße 16, D-65201 Wiesbaden, Germany
> > http://www.ritual.org
> > Fon: +49-700-ULIZAPPE
> > Fax: +49-700-ZAPPEFAX
> > _________________________________________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored.
> Colorsync-users mailing list (email@hidden)
> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription:
>
>
> This email sent to email@hidden
>
--
Roy Harrington
email@hidden
www.harrington.com
_______________________________________________
Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored.
Colorsync-users mailing list (email@hidden)
Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription:
This email sent to email@hidden