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Re: WOBuilder Replacement
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Re: WOBuilder Replacement


  • Subject: Re: WOBuilder Replacement
  • From: Michael Warner <email@hidden>
  • Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 16:11:20 -0700

... and if someone has not already mentioned it, it is important to understand web standards and accessibility guidelines and to do those extra things that make your site accessible to those with disabilities and others who would not otherwise be able to access your site. So at least someone on your team should have a sophisticated understanding of html, css, and how to leverage the two so that your clients will be assured that the information on your site will reach the widest possible audience. And... it’s the right thing to do.

Mike W.

On Jul 6, 2007, at 2:57 PM, Steven Mark McCraw wrote:

I'm kicking my own ass for keeping this thread going, but I couldn't resist. Until about a year ago, I was pretty dependent on WO Builder, just because I'd never put together templates any other way, so I know how a lot of the people who are complaining that there is no rendering previewish editor feel. But in truth, WO Builder forced me into some pretty sloppy HTML and haphazard templating, and I never would have realized that if I hadn't switched to editing the HTML by hand. It was a little bumpy for a while, but honestly now that I'm used to it, I wouldn't use a WO Builder like tool even if one were available. I just feel like a better coder now, and things make more sense in a lot of places, and I'm really expanding in terms of my usage of HTML/CSS (Having a visual tool kept me stuck in the world of always using tables for layout, etc).

When you have to look at the HTML, you suddenly discover a lot of ways to make things better. So I encourage anyone writing in who can't bear the thought of not having WO Builder to bite the bullet and try using the WOLips component editor for a month and see what happens. If you still hate it, go back to using WO Builder. There's no reason you can't use WO Builder and Eclipse together, although the integration isn't quite as good as it was with XCode (because when you make a change, you have to go back to Eclipse and refresh the component there before the change will show up in your running app).

Mark

On Jul 6, 2007, at 5:36 PM, Chuck Hill wrote:


On Jul 6, 2007, at 2:07 PM, Louis Demers wrote:


On 6-Jul-07, at 16:33 , Andrew Lindesay wrote:

Hello Janine;

The only feature of WOBuilder that I consider important is the one
that helps you to visualize what your component will look like when
it's rendered. WOBuilder always did a lousy job of this, especially

It's interesting; we all have quite different ways of working with components which probably illustrates different ways of thinking. I really do like Mike's component editor, but to augment it, I would also enjoy the visual modeller in WOB. I really do not feel at all like I need a full render of the page with data or anything -- what WOB does is perfect for my use. It's really a logical view for making bindings. I'd love to have the time for such an undertaking. :-/

You expressed exactly what I was trying to say. Indeed, I believe that the graphical presentation must not aim at the aesthetics of the page/component but rather it's structure along with a decent inspector for the available bindings. The aesthetics of the presentation should be done through CSS and could be handed off to other tools like CSSEdit and the like.


In a sense, couldn't it be structured like the eomodeler in eclipse ? A tree showing the structure and some inspector specific to the webobject tags being edited ?

Two thoughts:

1. If you have clean, well formatted HTML the structure is usually evident. Even with larger forms and tables, the ability to collapse sections can still make it easy to see. Or, like Mike posted, you can use the Outline view. Yes, Eclipse is amazing.

2. There is already an inspector (of sorts) for the WO tag being edited. Click on the tag in the HTML and the WOD portion automatically scrolls to the definition in the WOD. Ctrl-space in the definition to see all bindings ( foo =). Adding an inspector is probably not too much work, though perhaps of little benefit once you have gotten used to auto-complete.

So it is not really too far off what you want with no real need for a full blown WO Builder.


Chuck


--

Practical WebObjects - for developers who want to increase their overall knowledge of WebObjects or who are trying to solve specific problems.
http://www.global-village.net/products/practical_webobjects






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References: 
 >Re: WOBuilder Replacement (From: Andrew Lindesay <email@hidden>)
 >Re: WOBuilder Replacement (From: Louis Demers <email@hidden>)
 >Re: WOBuilder Replacement (From: Chuck Hill <email@hidden>)
 >Re: WOBuilder Replacement (From: Steven Mark McCraw <email@hidden>)

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