Re: A WebObjects article on Appleinsider
Re: A WebObjects article on Appleinsider
- Subject: Re: A WebObjects article on Appleinsider
- From: Chuck Hill <email@hidden>
- Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 15:42:15 -0700
On Jul 8, 2009, at 3:09 PM, Mike Schrag wrote:
seriously? I remember the exact inverse statements being made
when, only four-ish years ago, they tied WO's release schedule
back into the main development tools. I think it's good news, but
hopefully it means that they'll stop developing their unnecessary
deployment that virtually nobody uses and focus on the frameworks
instead.
Oh, you mean that deployment style virtually everybody but a few
folks are using should be dropped?
I've since reinterpreted Bill's comment to mean "everyone in the
world of java" not "everyone in the world of wo" ... And I would
agree with that, and there are technologies that are actually very
similar to pieces of the WO deployment system that would be worth
investigating to find the ideal solution to this problem.
Yes, I'll not argue that the current system is ideal! Or that we
can't usefully leverage some of the other technology out there. Like
you, I am not convinced that a J2EE container is a better solution.
It is certainly a valid solution and makes it much, much easier to
find cheap commercial hosting.
We're really in no different of a position than something like
Rails is, except that we actually have a "nice" gui for managing
clustering whereas everyone else is hand editing apache files. If
you look at modern rails deployment, you'll find a pretty similar
progression to what WO has (cgi, fast cgi, mod_proxy_balancer,
custom apache module, etc). I don't think deploying in a J2EE
container is necessarily the best solution, and in fact makes
deployment HARDER in many cases (it's kind of nice that you can just
run your main method and get a running server ... there's a lot of
value in that that should not be discounted). I would love to see
war deployment not suck and be less clunky -- I think switching to
jar frameworks probably makes a lot more sense for j2ee deployment,
for instance.
I've said it before -- Our zero state story is crappy: how do you
get wo, how do you start making wo apps, how do you launch them, how
do you debug them, how do you deploy wo, what if you are deploying
to an environment that doesn't have wo installed. Once you get your
environment going, these things MMMMooossttllly sort of kind of work
right. But getting from zero to there sucks, and I believe every
single one of those can be made better.
No argument from me on any of that! I just wish that I had more time
to devote to it.
Chuck
--
Chuck Hill Senior Consultant / VP Development
Practical WebObjects - for developers who want to increase their
overall knowledge of WebObjects or who are trying to solve specific
problems.
http://www.global-village.net/products/practical_webobjects
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