Re: Hudson and Client-Side Classes
Re: Hudson and Client-Side Classes
- Subject: Re: Hudson and Client-Side Classes
- From: Chuck Hill <email@hidden>
- Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 20:32:03 -0700
On Jun 15, 2009, at 6:30 PM, Michael Schrag wrote:
Maven == Ant cubed. Or maybe Obsfucated Ant. :-P
Chuck, are you speaking from experience here or just shootin' the
breeze? David, do you know how much 'set-up' is required to use
maven with Hudson?
All this toying around with environments etc sounds tiring. :-)
I've had the pleasure of using Maven some now and you're not really
giving the full story here ... So far, any time something has gone
wrong in Maven, it's been a completely nasty pain to diagnose. At
least with ant, it's stupid simple for better or worse.
That has been my experience as well. It is probably different if you
have worked on building the Maven support, but for Joe User wandering
into a Maven project and trying to track down what is wrong has been
much harder than doing the same in an Ant project. Even old Ant
projects where they used some XML DTD hack to simulate importing.
Dependancy management is Maven's forté, not transparency.
Mind you, I'm not an ant fan either -- I have the exact same hatred
that Chuck has, but it's really misleading to suggest that Maven
will just magically fix all your build problems. It makes a class
of problems easier, but it brings along a bunch of its own new ones
as well.
<notDirectlyMavensFaultIDontThinkButRelatedPain>On top of the core
Maven complexity, I can't even leave the maven plugins installed in
eclipse because it pretty well destroys my WOLips plugin development
environment by (as far as I can tell) fiddling with my project
classpaths incorrectly. I'm wondering if maybe because there's a pom
up higher in the wolips checkout (even though I import subprojects
that don't have poms) that it's screwing with maven into trying to
do things that it shouldn't, but i really have no idea. i just know
that when the maven plugins aren't installed things always work and
when they are, seemingly randomly all my plugin projects break.</
notDirectlyMavensFaultIDontThinkButRelatedPain>
When it comes down to it, SOMEONE has to do the heavy lifting both
in Maven and in Ant. In Maven, you guys have done a bunch of work on
the custom archetype stuff, and in ant we've done a bunch of work on
the custom build.xml that the WOLips project uses. I use completely
stock ant build files from WOLips and it takes me literally about a
minute to setup a new project in Hudson that builds along with its
dependencies -- I really don't feel any pain with this. Dave is
obviously something a little different than most here,
Oh, Dave is a LOT different than most! :-P
and I suspect there are edge cases in both the Maven tooling as well
as the stock build.xml's. If what you're doing is outside of what
the author of your build tools intended, you're going to have a bad
day, no matter what you're using.
True fact, that.
Chuck
--
Chuck Hill Senior Consultant / VP Development
Come to WOWODC'09 in San Fran this June!
http://www.wocommunity.org/wowodc09/
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