Re: Problems with current Apple X11 package
Re: Problems with current Apple X11 package
- Subject: Re: Problems with current Apple X11 package
- From: "John J. Francini" <email@hidden>
- Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:23:07 -0500
At 20:08 -0800 1/29/03, magenta wrote:
Okay, I just upgraded to Jaguar, and decided that while I was doing that I
should go ahead and try Apple's X11 instead of XDarwin. I have found the
following pros and cons:
Pros:
- The hardware OpenGL is very nice (though its vertex array support seems
broken)
Cons:
- The package doesn't seem to include the Xlib header files, and I
can't find them anywhere on the Apple or OpenDarwin sites
That's because it's in its own package -- X11SDKforMacOSX -- which
has to be downloaded and installed separately. Separating out the
developer bits from those needed for ordinary end-users is quite
common for Apple. If you go to the X11 download page at
<http://www.apple.com/macosx/x11/> and scroll all the way to the
bottom, you'll see the download link for the SDK on the bottom right.
- The X desktop isn't clipped to the actual screen desktop, so my
windows (using pwm) have their title bar obscured by the menu bar
(very annoying)
Only Apple's window manager knows about the menubar; the others from
UNIX-land do not. It's the job of the window manager to deal with
"sacred" areas, not the X Server. Also, given that some applications
(such as QuickTime Player or DVD Player) can turn off the menubar for
a full-screen display, there's precedent for the X server not being
constrained to only the space below the menubar.
- X11.app doesn't set my path correctly (whereas XDawin.app did),
or maybe this is an issue with Jaguar vs. 10.1, but in any case it makes
my old .xinitrc fail badly
- It assumes too much about the window manager being quartz-wm, and ends up
integrating very poorly with other WMs which don't have such atrocious
accessibility issues; specifically, window raising and focus are horribly
awkward
Quartz-wm definitely needs help to make it play better with all the
other Mac app siblings, especially around window raising and focus.
However, for my purposes, it's so much less jarring and awkward to
use a window manager that _tries_ to be Mac-like, rather than one
that has a completely different set of rules, such as
<insert-your-favorite-WM-here>. The X server also needs to be better
at translating Mac-specific gestures, such as command-tab to cycle
through windows, into something a window manager can deal with.
It's unfortunate that the mailinglist archives have no search function for
this list, or else I'd have been able to actually see if any of these
issues have been addressed amidst all of the other issues which should be
discussed in a FAQ (one of which I also can't find for this list).
So, is there a package for the header files? If so, where, if not, why
not?
Yes; see above.
Is there a way to configure the X server to not consider the menu bar as
part of the desktop? If so, where, if not, why not?
I don't believe there is. Why? Because that's the job of the window
manager, not the X server. Since most of the other fine WMs are
open-source, I would think it shouldn't take too much programming to
add a special case to them to hold the menubar area sacred and change
the origins of any incoming windows to avoid it.
Is there a way to configure the initial path of the X server? If so,
where, if not, why not?
Is there a way to configure the window-raise policy of the X server? If
so, where, if not why not?
Thank you.
--
http://trikuare.cx
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--
----
John Francini <mailto:email@hidden>
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