Re: Jobs
Re: Jobs
- Subject: Re: Jobs
- From: Steve Klingsporn <email@hidden>
- Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 19:39:55 -0600
I read and understood the job description correctly the first time.
It's a very good thing that Apple is doing this. Why? Because it
would most likely get rid of the Java bridge, would probably unify the
Java and Objective-C exception models (they'd probably go with whatever
the JVM is doing to remain compatible with future VM's from Sun), would
assure that a VM is probably most always running, cutting down on
initial start-up time for Cocoa-Java apps, and would make Cocoa-Java
the first really successful (if Apple ever increases its ever-dwindling
market share) implementation of "Java on the Desktop."
Compiling Java into native code would simply be taking the compilation
part of Hotspot and offering it as part of the build process so that it
would not have to happen initially when a class is loaded, but as I see
it, it doesn't really matter. Performance is not very easily
distinguishable between Cocoa-Java and Objective-C Cocoa applications,
as far as I can tell. Hotspot works pretty well.
The VM has not at all proven itself unfit for desktop applications. In
fact, Java is a widely-used and widely-accepted language, whereas
Objective-C is quite obscure. Sure, it might be "better" than C++ in
terms of adding OO functionality to the C language, but the reality of
the situation is Apple is shooting itself in the foot by trying to get
developers to learn a language that is not readily spoken. There are
tons of Java developers out there. This would be great for Java as
well as Mac OS X. I'm sure you'll still be able to write Objective-C
code, and I'm sure the performance won't suffer from it at all.
Go grab my game, Aquataxx. Play with it a bit, and tell me you can
tell it's written in Java.
http://www.buzzlabs.com/aquataxx/
Cocoa, actually, is a great way to develop desktop applications in
Java, and the language is really secondary. Cocoa is all about rapid
development. Apple obviously sees great value in Java, and this is the
best news I've heard in quite some time coming from Apple with regards
to its commitment to Java.
The only place where Objective-C is widely (and not very, at that)
spoken is Apple.
Steve
(Just found a QA job -- hey, it's a job)
On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 07:20 PM, Scott Anguish wrote:
On Saturday, November 16, 2002, at 05:22 PM, Steve Klingsporn wrote:
No, this is very good news, I think. If done right. I'm excited.
Java is a great language.
Apple: PLEASE SUPPORT COMPILING JAVA. Thanks. =)
You need to re-read the job description.
It talks about merging Obj-C and the Java VM. This is not the same
thing as compiling Java. It is not a good thing either. Apple has
sold developers on Obj-C now. This is not the time to make changes.
Apple tried the "Java" flavor of Objective-C a few years ago and
nobody cared. I can't see where making Obj-C as bloated and slow as
Java is going to be a good thing.
Java may be a "great language", but the VM has proven itself unfit
for Desktop Applications. If you're going to write Java, you're
better of sticking to the Pure Java stuff, and ignoring Cocoa.
As scary as this job thread was (and some of the stands being taken
in it), this jobreq scared me much more.
Scott Anguish
(who is also looking for a job)
http://www.digifix.com/resume.html
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