Re:Defining what you want
Re:Defining what you want
- Subject: Re:Defining what you want
- From: Matt Deatherage <email@hidden>
- Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 17:29:02 -0500
[I changed the subject line to separate threads]
On 6/20/04 at 12:38 PM, Andrew Rodney <email@hidden> wrote:
>
If we universally assume all untagged RGB images are sRGB, we might
>
be right sometimes, we might be wrong sometimes
This was not so much my point in asking about "color space" vs.
"profile." My point was that the terminology is imprecise and thrown
around as if everyone knows all about it, and it's not true. If I were
writing a ColorSync manual, I'd have already decided to always say
"sRGB color space" or "sRGB profile" to make it clearer what function
I'm talking about.
>
At least with a lot of capture devices producing untagged images,
>
sRGB is usually a pretty close guess (even though none of them
>
actually produce sRGB). What devices are close to producing "Generic
>
RGB" (whatever that's supposed to be).
Yeah, I fail to see how renaming it " 'Generic RGB' (whatever that's
supposed to be" is helpful.
I'm guessing that the answer to the real question is "if an image has
no embedded source profile, embed the one specified in the ColorSync
Preferences when you write it to disk." If that's not the answer, then
replace "the one specified in the ColorSync Preferences" with the right
answer.
>
It should because the Adobe color architecture is clever, flexible
>
and works really well. [...]
And I certainly believe that, and it's manifestly irrelevant.
I'm a small programmer. I'm writing Preview, or SimpleImage, or
GraphicConverter, or Snapz Pro. If I ask about color matching, and the
answer I get is "spend two weeks researching Photoshop 5 and later
because it's good," I'm done. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going
to spend days and days writing this code for what is essentially a
check-off feature, nor will I spend days researching it. If you can't
give me a better answer than "Imitate what Photoshop does," it's not
going to happen. And _that_ is why so many programs completely ignore
color management.
As far as I can tell, the APIs for this stuff are not complicated at all; any developer can use an embedded profile or embed one without so much as a blink. If you want them to embed profiles in images that don't have any, though, you're going to have to provide simple rules for what one to use. "It depends on a 12 X 12 matrix plotting philosophies against device metrics" won't cut it.
I'm not getting into the sRGB vs. Generic RGB debate; I'm just saying there needs to be a short, sweet answer to the question. If you expect every application to include full profile choices and a dialog box and all that, then you need to tell Apple to put an API for that into the system, because that's the only way it's going to happen. There'd be no "Services" menu if applications had to build it themselves; there'd be no programs using OpenType font features (outside of huge DTP apps) if ATSUI didn't do it for them, because programmers aren't going to spend weeks on this.
Tell them how to get it done in one day and *they'll do it.* Make it more complicated and they won't.
>
Once we get an idea what the hell their doing (and that's a moving
>
target as seen between Jaguar and Panther and now we are told, things
>
will change in Tiger).
You think the definitions of "display profile" and "color space" will
change in Tiger?
On 6/20/04 at 1:46 PM, bruce fraser <email@hidden> wrote:
>
1.) I've yet to find an application that actually uses Generic RGB
>
rather than usermonitorRGB for untagged images.
Oh, joy, _another_ term for "display color space" (I think). That's what we need, more terms to use for the same concepts. Things were starting to get too clear.
--
Matt Deatherage <email@hidden> <
http://www.macjournals.com>
I read this list in digest mode; copy me privately for faster responses
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