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Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports?
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Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports?


  • Subject: Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports?
  • From: Stephen Davis <email@hidden>
  • Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 09:13:09 -0800

On Jan 22, 2008, at 5:57 AM, Brian Willoughby wrote:

Thanks for the pointer to the RME FireFace 800. I have sent a message to their support contact and identified myself as a Mac OS X developer needing this feature.

That's cool but I still need a switcher. I found a 4-port one here that looks promising, esp. because it has RS-232 control support for changing inputs. Hook that up in front of an RME FireFace 800 and now we're talking. :-)


http://www.inday.com/da4x/da4x.htm

But I am a still little surprised that you would see many zero samples. I have encoded 4.0 audio into a 5.1 DTS stream, simply because I had no need for a center channel, and I imagine that this was very wasteful of bandwidth. But it seems like a full 5.1 mix with audio in all channels and significant LFE energy would use nearly all of the 1.5 Mbps bandwidth available. I will take your word for it, though, since I have not done any analysis of commercial releases to see if my assumptions are correct.

DD transmission over SPDIF theoretically can use the extra space to send the bitstreams for secondary languages, up to 8. That way, the receiver can pick which language it wants. I have yet to see any sending devices that do this though.


For DTS, the DVD bit rate is typically less than 1.5Mbps -- I think it's 768Kbps. For Red Book Audio CDs they typically use the entire 1.5Mbps. Neat point about the 14-bit usage though, I thought they were being super clever and manipulating the bitstream layout such that it sounds more like white noise. Of course, if you use all of the bandwidth then you don't have the bursts + zeros either so that might mitigate the issue too.

Going back to a previous question, yes the DD sync word is two valid 16-bit samples but the DD over SPDIF specification recommends searching for 4 leading zeros first to reduce the likelihood of collision even further. In practice (so far), I have not found the extended sync word necessary.

stephen

If only all digital audio devices were interconnected with FireWire and clocked by the final DAC rather than the data source, I think we wouldn't be stuck with such unwieldy standards as S/P-DIF.

Brian Willoughby
Sound Consulting


On Jan 22, 2008, at 05:01, Mikael Hakman wrote:

That sounds cool -- which FW device is that?

What is the FireWire interface with 32-bit integer format for digital audio (SPDIF)? Does it need a special driver to work with a Mac?

It's RME Fireface 800. According to User's Guide there are drivers for both operating systems on the disk, and installation procedures are well described.


P.S. DTS only uses the lower 14 bits of the audio sample, so that the digital noise is at -12 dB. Seems like a shame to lose 96 kbps of bandwidth.

Not only that! If you look at the actual content of SPDIF when transmitting DD or DTS then you'll see that large parts of each block do not transmit any information at all. All samples are set to zero. This is because compressed data, even for 6 channels, require much fewer bytes than 2 channels PCM for corresponding time length. Each block in SPDIF is of fixed byte length, and for given rate, also of fixed time length. Therefore they have to fill it with zeros when actual data for this time length is shorter. Talk about wasting bandwidth! All this seems to steam from the fact that SPDIF was designed to transfer digital audio *signals* as opposed to *data*. Then someone come up with the brilliant idea of sending compressed data through it. Then AES adopted all this, and now we are where we are.


Regards/Mikael

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  • Follow-Ups:
    • Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports?
      • From: "Mikael Hakman" <email@hidden>
    • Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports?
      • From: Brian Willoughby <email@hidden>
References: 
 >OT: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: Stephen Davis <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: "Mikael Hakman" <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: Stephen Davis <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: "Mikael Hakman" <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: Brian Willoughby <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: "Mikael Hakman" <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: Brian Willoughby <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: "Mikael Hakman" <email@hidden>)
 >Re: I/O device with multiple *independent* SPDIF ports? (From: Brian Willoughby <email@hidden>)

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