Re: plea! (was Re: Two enhancement requests)
Re: plea! (was Re: Two enhancement requests)
- Subject: Re: plea! (was Re: Two enhancement requests)
- From: Roy Lovejoy <email@hidden>
- Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 00:04:26 -0700
On May 8, 2005, at 11:35 PM, Scott Tooker wrote:
You guys do know that you would gain 100% mindshare if you offered as
complete a "virtual codewarrior" as you could.. (alternate UI/ window
grouping/key binding etc)
See below but we actually do both of these :)
well.. perhaps that's where an XCode person may look at the work and
say "wow, this portion is so unlike XCode, it must be like
Codewarrior".. but a person who uses Codewarrior 14 hours a day goes
"What's this supposed to be like again??"
despite all the way-cool _engineering_ features in XCode, and the
hand-glove fit of IB/Cocoa/XCode, to a majority of Codewarrior folk,
XCode just feels... 'wrong' to a "project thinking" developer..
I find these comments ironic since we modeled our current groups &
files hierarchy on the CodeWarrior model (i.e. you can have groups
that are totally divorced from the file system and organize your
sources with them). However, we've also gone beyond the basic groups
and files models to provide other features like folder references (the
ability to have an item that refers to a folder), smart groups,
filtering in the detail view, variant groups to organize localized
files, etc.
Well.. it could be ironic if either the mark was completely missed, or
there's a mode that this project was put in that made the group
hierarchy invisible..
I'm hoping it was the latter.. (indeed, that's what I thought I had
heard), but I'm a firm believer in playing with an interface, usually
recursively, to try to visit the features, and I can't see how to see a
"groups & files" hierarchy..
If I do a search for "Codewarrior" in XCode help, nothing comes up..
"Files in a Project" shows the "Soruces" "Headers" etc.. 'flat'
conglomeration..
are what you are referring to called "Smart Groups"..
If you've gone to the trouble of modeling groups & files hierarchy on a
Codewarrior model, it would be nice if a Codewarrior user could
navigate the feature..
(Is this called 'Smart Groups'??).
As we improve Xcode, we are trying to find the balance between making
things familiar and making things work the "right" way. Part of this
is providing ways to make the experience easier for those coming from
CodeWarrior or other environments. However, the other part is making
sure that Xcode provides the best workflow possible, and if that means
doing things differently from other IDEs (when it matters), then
that's what we'll do. And I'm sure we will hear from our developers
about it, for good or bad :)
Don't ever think for a moment that I claim a 'right' way or a 'wrong'
way.. I'm just talking muscle memory here..
If XCode can do 'XCode' way, and 'Codewarrior' way, then I would think
all would be happy in C/C++ land..
I guess it would be nice to see in the online documentation, (if
trademarks permit), if there would be a liberal sprinkling of "In
Codewarrior, this would be [foo], and it would look like [bar.jpg]".
To sum up, we are always interested in feedback about how to make
Xcode a better product and more accessible and familiar to developers.
That is *VERY* reassuring.. Seriously.. Long term, career wise,
reassuring.
However, we aren't interested in replicating any given IDE's
UI/workflow as an end in itself.
understood..
After all if Xcode works just like "X", why not just use "X"?
Umm.. isn't that the echoing mantra of
ghosts-of-command-line/intel-platforms-past???
an admirable goal would be to *inclusively* bring *all* of the Mac
developers into the Apple/XCode fold, not issue the 'my way, or the
high-way' marketing bullet item..
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