Re: Printing with No Color Management (again)
Re: Printing with No Color Management (again)
- Subject: Re: Printing with No Color Management (again)
- From: MARK SEGAL <email@hidden>
- Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 04:49:15 -0700 (PDT)
Very helpful insights Chris.
You relate as fact, which you are well-positioned to do, that a great many
people have experienced problems with ICC CM only on Mac, but not on Windows or
Linux. In the specific instance of not being able to disable CM for purposes of
printing profiling targets, if my memory serves me correctly, this has been
identified as an issue triggered by a Mac OSX up-date - not the Epson driver and
not Photoshop. If this is all correct, that tells me Apple should do something
about it. I don't buy into the notion that it's normal and acceptable because it
only affects x% of the client base, notwithstanding that it's broken and very
important to that client group, whether they are large or small. Those people
invested their confidence and money in Apple computer only to be let down badly
on this stuff. If this is what informs Apple's corporate ethics, I can only
express my opinion that it's abusive to treat customers as statistically
insignificant, rather than acknowledging there's a legitimate issue facing those
customers and fixing it.
Mark
________________________________
From: Chris Murphy <email@hidden>
To: Forum ColorSync <email@hidden>
Sent: Wed, April 27, 2011 2:30:58 AM
Subject: Re: Printing with No Color Management (again)
On Apr 26, 2011, at 5:36 PM, MARK SEGAL wrote:
> Thanks for trying Chris, and I hope we hear more from you on this as you can
>manage it, your time permitting.
>
> How does the imaging community get through the heads of key people at Apple
>that they need to correct what they've messed up?
>
I don't have a good suggestion, maybe others do? I have heard they read feedback
from http://www.apple.com/feedback/
I do not think the key people at Apple responsible for this component consider
the current behavior incorrect or messed up. If they did, I have no reason to
believe they wouldn't fix it. Once Apple considers something not working
correctly, I generally feel they're rather motivated to fix it. Maybe not
instantly in days or weeks, but it eventually does get fixed.
I don't know if the user pain is not being communicated. I do think that the
current behavior seems reasonable and clear to Apple, and aren't really
impressed that certain developers continue to have problems with this area to
the point they've arrived at, "this must be too difficult for them, we need to
step in and figure out a different way of handling this use case."
All speculation on my part.
What is not speculation: I know for a fact large numbers of professional and
amateur photographers who depend on ICC workflows have run into color management
problems, over the past 7+ years, only on Mac OS, and only in the context of
printing profile targets and prematched image content, i.e. a need for a clear
off switch for ColorSync. And what's happening is that "off switch" is being
second guessed instead of considered a sacrosanct, clear cutoff. I've had the
problem. I've had four years of SVA masters photography students intermittently
have the the problem, with the past two years being the worst I've ever seen.
I've had customers have this problem. And I've had colleagues have the problem.
I see no light at the end of the tunnel, or improvement in predicted what OS,
driver, or application update is going to "break" and cause yet a new
manifestation of inconsistent printing where ColorSync off is required.
And "the problem" does not manifest itself in a way that makes it obvious there
is a role for Apple to even look at the problem, let alone own it. The most
obvious component to blame for prints that don't come out right is the print
driver, and a close second is the application producing the print job.
But I keep coming back to, these problems don't happen on Windows. They don't
happen on Linux. There is never any second guessing, or even first guessing, by
system level color management on those platforms. They require engraved
invitations for system level color management to come to the party. On Mac OS
even an engraved uninvitation can be questioned. It's seriously like a booger
you can't flick off, sometimes. That's just fragile and in my view is the source
of why we keep seeing these print related problems in the very specific case of
printing ICC profile targets, and (application) prematched print jobs. That is
an inherently small market so there may also just be a small number of
complaints relative to the larger user pool, and these complaints are
statistically "normal" or "acceptable."
And so it goes.
Chris Murphy _______________________________________________
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